If you've done Singapore 3...

[Mom2Monkeys]

...did you make any type of plans like teaching notes, hands-on activities,etc. that you'd be willing to share with me? My dd8/3rd grade is about to move up to 3A and I realized she is not yet ready to move out of the hands-on and I'm not creative enough to come up with my own. I guess many kids are starting 3A in 4th grade and are more ready to drop the manipulatives. I do believe I am having a math-breakdown. Darn those pregnancy hormones!

Without the activities planned out for me and with my math teaching coming from the public school system, my mind doesn't comprehend the Singapore way very well and I have a hard time teaching it on my own. I LOVE Carrie's activities and have loved SM using those. I'm trying to figure out how to teach it without having to pay $40 to get the HIG's....I know it's great and easy to teach, but teaching 3A to a young 3rd grader without hands-on doesn't work in my mind or hers. I also need to work on add/subt facts with her...she does NOT have these down at all. She is in need of more review (I gave her some add and subt problems with borrowing and carrying and she couldn't remember how to do it. She also could not subt. simple problems like 15-8...she did the ones (5-8) and her answer was 0...the tens (1-0) was 1...so 15-8=10. Was not encouraging for me. She is very bright, but not a mathy kid. I love the mental math and concepts in SM but I wonder if she needs more review or a different approach. I thought it was working so well, but was a little bit shocked and discouraged by this display. I know Singapore is the best math program out there but wonder if for some kids, like my dd, there might be more fitting choices.

We just started back to school and I'm just bummed by her lack of retention and her growing dislike for math. I have one other mental math/conceptual based math program in mind, but want some help from you all first! It's not as complete as SM, but has a similar philosophy, scripted lessons with hands-on in the 3rd level which is what we need now. I'm thinking of giving her the Singapore Placement test for the levels she is finishing (2A and 2B) to see if she passes. If she does, we'll keep truckin' in SM. If not, I'm more apt to think my dd is one of few SM isn't working for. She has some "issues" and needs repetition and a semi-spiral type program.

Sorry for venting and thinking out loud...my posts get long when I do that as I'm sure you've noticed! It's the panic!

[Daisy]

I'm wondering if the $40 TM's include hands-on activities. If so, I might make the plunge. My daughter is nearly 10 and will be doing 3B/4A in the fall. She STILL loves hands on activities just to reinforce the concept.

I do have Family Math. You might look that up at your library. It has wonderful activities. Maybe I can just go through it and correlate them to Singapore (sounds like work).

[Mom2Monkeys]

I'll look into that...I just don't have time to correlate it to SM! I wish I did.

I just gave her to 2A test and we're almost done with 2B. She scored 38 our of 100. She was totally frustrated with every bit of it. I didn't bother with 2B.

He biggest gaps:
Word Problems-- can rarely determine which operation to use, if she does she can't do it if it's subtract with borrowing
Simple division by 2 and 3- no clue
Subtraction in general is not strong
Subtraction with borrowing- not at all
Weights (kg/g, lb/oz)

I thought she had all these aced except needing reminding of how to borrow in subtraction. We're almost done with 2B and she can't even pass the 2A test! I'm not sure what to do but I think I'll take the summer and fall semester to do Making Math Meaningful 3 so we can put off starting SM3-- just as a review and time filler. We'll start 3A in the second semester of 3rd grade if she's ready. I think...unless someone else has better ideas. I'm all ears!

[pollo_la]

Okay, I am by no means an expert here... I have NEVER taught math and my oldest is only 4 Anyway, here are my thoughts on it.

From everything I have heard about SM, your dd is VERY young to be attempting 3A!!! What if you started 2B again with her (using the hands on stuff in the HOD guide along with it) but did it at half the pace. AND did another math program along with it for this next year. That way she would have some math from a slightly different approach, BUT she would still be learning math the Singapore way as well. I'm willing to bet that she would do MUCH better with Singapore 3A in another year.

[Mom2Monkeys]

We already did all the hands-on activities using the HOD guide. So, I'm thinking of using another program over the summer and fall and waiting on Singapore 3, like you said. She tested and placed into Singapore 2A when we started HOD with Beyond in 2nd grade after completing Horizons 2 in 1st. Now she still places into 2A. I don't get it, b/c she really seemed to be "getting it"! She's just the kind of kid who needs frequent visits with the topics in order to remember them as well as still needing hands-on.

Here's my tentative plan: (mostly touching base on all topics and digging deep on weak areas with MMM)
2nd grade- SM 2A/B (just finishing this)
Summer- MMM2 rather quickly and start MMM3 (start with 2 to reteach from the bottom up and to get her facts down)
3rd grade- Finish MMM3 and start MMM4 at regular pace (3 will be focusing on weak areas which is why we should be able to finish start 4)
Summer- Finish MMM4
4th grade- finish MMM4, start SM 3, plus extra SM workbooks

[Heather]

I have used the Home Instructor Guides that Singapore produces. They have a lot of hands-on activities, mental math drills in the back and a lot of instruction. I highly recommend them.

http://www.singaporemath.com/Primary_Ma ... d_s/39.htm

Also, Sonlight sells them.

Heather

[Mom2Monkeys]

After finding that MMM author Mr. Quine suggests a 2-3 day per week schedule at 1-1.5 hours per day to teach the lessons, I'm leaning toward SM3, but slowly (2-3 days per week) and add in Calculadder 1 and Math Mammoth to work on gaps. We didn't use SM when those concepts she's so weak in were taught and she's doing well with all the Singapore taught topics. BUT, she does need more review.
So, after we fill in gaps, I need to figure out which SM book would be best to use for review-- Extra Practice, Intensive, or Challenging Word Problems. And I still have to decide if dd8 is really ready for it...maybe we'll do parts of 2A/B intensive practice and Calculadders 1 over the summer to build up her skills and confidence again. My preference would be to wait on SM3, but I can't do MMM if it's going to take that long for each lesson! I will be getting the SM3 HIG's if we go with SM.

Pray for my decision making please!

[Benelli]

I don't have any advice for you, but I'll pray for your decision! It's tough, I know! I have a big Singapore decision for 2 of my kiddos as well. Praying you will come to a decision you are completely at peace with!

[dale1088]

Tamara, I could have written your post! I pulled dd from 3rd grade pub sch in December and she placed in Singapore 2A. Most of the beginning of it was review, but as soon as we got to regrouping she hit a wall, so we took some time with it. I added in some Spectrum workbook pages, and we kept on moving, but I have this strange "vibe" or intuition, that she's not really getting it. She forgets the regrouping processes and simply does not have a good grasp on her facts. I just think there is flat out not enough review in SM. I have those triangle flash cards but I don't know what to do with them.

I made a commitment to stick with SM because I have heard so many people bemoan the fact that they jumped around, and I have since ordered the 3A&B texts/workbooks/HIG and CWP. But now I am questioning it.

I wonder about the feasibility of doing something else alongside SM? I can't afford something like RightStart or MUS, and I don't think I want something that will take forever with the lessons and be a huge shift in the processes like Saxon or Abeka. I am considering CLE. Have you looked at it at all? I am hearing lots of good things about it on the WTM forums.

Just feelin' your pain! I hope more folks chime in. Part of me just wants someone to say "Look, forget all this and switch to MUS for your whole program and your dd will do great - all the way through!" Is someone going to say that...

[Mom2Monkeys]

Tamara, I could have written your post! I pulled dd from 3rd grade pub sch in December and she placed in Singapore 2A. Most of the beginning of it was review, but as soon as we got to regrouping she hit a wall, so we took some time with it. I added in some Spectrum workbook pages, and we kept on moving, but I have this strange "vibe" or intuition, that she's not really getting it. She forgets the regrouping processes and simply does not have a good grasp on her facts. I just think there is flat out not enough review in SM. I have those triangle flash cards but I don't know what to do with them.

I made a commitment to stick with SM because I have heard so many people bemoan the fact that they jumped around, and I have since ordered the 3A&B texts/workbooks/HIG and CWP. But now I am questioning it.

I wonder about the feasibility of doing something else alongside SM? I can't afford something like RightStart or MUS, and I don't think I want something that will take forever with the lessons and be a huge shift in the processes like Saxon or Abeka. I am considering CLE. Have you looked at it at all? I am hearing lots of good things about it on the WTM forums.

Just feelin' your pain! I hope more folks chime in. Part of me just wants someone to say "Look, forget all this and switch to MUS for your whole program and your dd will do great - all the way through!" Is someone going to say that...

I've looked at pretty much everything you mentioned and nothing teaches mental math and thinking mathematically like SM. Most others (Saxon, Abeka....) just teach the steps, (like with subt. w/borrowing-- mark our the tens number and take one away, now add a one to make "3" a "13" and subtract.) Anyone can "memorize" the steps and anyone can forget them too easily when you don't know why you do that and what exactly you really did. The ONLY other program I would do would be Making Math Meaningful and only as a time filler if dc is not ready for the next SM level. But, it takes SO long to teach, as do most of the other programs. SM is top dog. It WILL work...you just have to know your child and if dc needs more review, then do it. If they need a break to work on facts (like mine who is getting older and STILL doesn't know them ), then add it in or break for a facts focus. Singapore is so complete, but some kids just need those couple of extras and it's not hard to add in. I'm still wishy washy though about deciding if dd is really ready for 3A I just don't know anything good enough to use for a year that doesn't take all day to teach! I'm going to get out my 3A books and really go through them...

[threegreatkids]

Tamara,

I think Singapore is great for different types of kiddos. My oldest (9 1/2) is very bright but not so mathy, and she's done very well with 2A/2B this year. She will do 3A/3B in 4th.

2nd dd is a couple months younger than your dd, and half way done with 2A. She picks up math quickly but I still like the level she's doing...much less frustration.

Singapore is interesting b/c you it seems that you fly through certain things and then BAM, there is a really tricky concept. But I've been AMAZED at the retention my kids have had, and how they do so very well on the Math Concepts portion of standardized tests. They have learned to think and figure things out.

What about getting the textbook for 2A/2B to review things that didn't really stick? Another interesting, hands-on math curriculum is Math on the Level. They have a website. You could use any of these (MMM, MotL) and then return to Singapore 3A in six months to a year.

I wouldn't be discouraged, she probably just wasn't ready for that level of Singapore yet so it didn't really stick.

[Mom2Monkeys]

I've emailed with the curriculum advisor on the SM site. She gave some good suggestions based on my dd's specifics. She also said...and I quote...

"In Singapore, school for each grade is during the calendar year. Students do Primary 1 during the calendar year they turn 7. So if your student is turning 8 this month, if in Singapore she will have completed 2A, and be starting on 2B in July. I think they have about a month off in June and in December."

DD should be starting 2B in July and instead is starting 3A. So, I think I need to take a good close look b/c as of now, dd is working ahead of even the Singapore children that have always done SM! I'll look at MotL too. I've also ordered the 3A HIG and am deciding on which workbook to add for dd.

Here's the two replies I received from the SM advisor for those that might be interested since some of you are stressing like I am! At least we know SM is a great, solid choice!

****Did you use the Home Instructor's Guides? There is a suggestion in it that you give her one or two subtraction and addition problems occasionally as you go through the rest of the year. It might be sufficient to do that now, simply have her work through some problems. Did you use actual place-value discs to illustrate the process, or just the pictures in the textbook? Is she weak because of not understanding to process, or not knowing her math facts well? For the word problems, did you discuss them in terms of part-whole? Have her fill in number bonds to determine whether to add or subtract? Let her draw pictures? Reword the problem with simpler numbers?

Extra Practice is easier than Intensive Practice, and shorter. Also less expensive. If you just want review and not challenge, you could get that. It might not have enough subtraction review. But you can easily make up problems or print worksheets from the internet.****

****Then possibly just practicing math facts along with some 3 digit subtraction, and more word problems? You could get Challenging Word Problems, or iExcel for more word problems. But if you want a variety of practice, then the Extra Practice is OK. It does have word problems as well as other problems.

Extra Practice is topically arranged, and follows the sequence in the Primary Mathematics. Somewhat drill-like, so there will be a page of the same kind of problems. Since it is only one book, it has maybe a third or a half of what the workbooks has. It may be sufficient for more review of earlier topics. You can sort of make it mixed review by circling the first few problems from 3-4 exercises, then the next few, and so on.

In Singapore, school for each grade is during the calendar year. Students do Primary 1 during the calendar year they turn 7. So if your student is turning 8 this month, if in Singapore she will have completed 2A, and be starting on 2B in July. I think they have about a month off in June and in December.****

[threegreatkids]

Tamara,
If you didn't want to switch over to a completely different curriculum what about this? Order the 2B Textbook, the 2B Home Instructors Guide (has lots of hands-on) and possibly a supplemental WB for 2B. The textbook would teach the concepts in a slightly different way plus it has alot of practice problems to do on separate paper. There are quite a few "Review" pages, which would be helpful for solidifying concepts. Sometimes I think a dc has understood something really well, and then when it is mixed up with other types of problems it isn't quite so easily retrieved.
Then when she finishes that, in 4-6 months, you could evaluate whether or not she's ready for 3A.
just a thought

[Mom2Monkeys]

I actually have the texts for 2A and B. I'll just go back through problem areas and do some work with her on the dry erase board and them let her use some hands-on stuff from Bigger's plans. I thought about getting the Extra practice book but dont' have enough money to get it along with the HIG's and Ex Prac book for 3...especially for just certain parts. So, we'll use the texts, finish 2B, and start 3A by doing the text/HIG/WB one day, and then the Extra Practice book the next. That will put us at half pace with plenty of review. I'll might even stagger our start and do just the text for a couple or 3 weeks/ 3 days per week, then start the practice book so we're actually reviewing instead of doing the same thing from the day before.

I'm going to order Calculadders 1 for her add/subt. facts as well. So, I think I've got it covered!