history cores for bigger hearts

Post by **Carrie** » Wed May 21, 2008 10:04 am

momof2n2,

That is a great question!

As I'm getting older and have reviewed most educational philosophies out there, I am finding more and more to love about the Charlotte Mason style of learning. I am not a purist for the CM- philosophy but much of makes sense to me after watching the way so many different children learn through the years!

Granted I still like to put some of my own twist on things,

but I preface my comments with that because ... Charlotte Mason advocated not interrupting the reading to define words, paraphrase, or interpret for the kiddos. When I considered that part of her philosophy, I thought about what I enjoy as a listener/reader. Do I stop every time I come to a word I don't know to look it up or define it? I personally do not, because it interrupts the flow of the story. Would I like someone to interrupt the storyline of a movie I'm watching to explain or paraphrase for me? I personally don't like to be interrupted when watching a movie for someone to explain things as I again lose the mood and feeling of the story.

Charlotte Mason says that if we want to comment on something we should do it before the reading to "set the stage". We also might make a comment or two after the reading, but limit those comments to more of a conversation than a lecture.

So, I'll let you decide what you think. To me, it makes much sense to just read and let the child make their own connections. It is also a lot more enjoyable for the person doing the reading! Try it and see if you enjoy that approach more. The real thinking comes in the narrating and the design of our guides that follows the daily readings.

Blessings,
Carrie

Melanie · Post by **Melanie** » Wed May 21, 2008 10:30 am

THis has been a great thread. I'm getting to catch up on all the threads with my "free time"!

I'm not to Bigger, yet, but what I do now with our readings is to try to read ahead the day before (not hard in Little Hearts since the readings are fairly short, but could get more difficult in the later guides) and if I find any words that might cause question, I tell the kids before I read to listen for that word and see if they can tell me what it means by the end of the reading. Usually they can determine the reading based on context, but if i didn't do this, I could see them interrupting to ask "what does that mean?" but this way they listen to the end and at least try to figure it out on their own.

It's also helped them to apply this to real life.....in conversations, tv shows or movies.....and not interrupt so often to ask for explanations. They are starting to learn that if they wait (and use a little of their underused patience) they might figure things out on their own!

annegirl1919 · Post by **annegirl1919** » Wed May 21, 2008 10:45 am

well, i appreciate all your responses. carrie, your point about their retention being better if they have to put it together themselves makes a lot of sense. i have only done two years of homeschool. lhth-which was a wonderful, well loved success, and mfwk which was received with much less enthusiasm, and we cut 1/2 of it out because she would have been miserable and it would have just been a fight the whole year.

i've figured out that if i work to find something that fits my child's learning style and personality, it makes our time together much more pleasant-and time together is one of my biggest reasons for homeschooling. i guess the more complex vocab and wording in the history cores in bigger scared me because i don't want another year of fighting through things daily with her, but yet i love hod so much that i didn't want to think it wouldn't work. your post have given me some good food for thought.

also, if i was having a hard time with that part, i was thinking i could use the cores, along with other books about the same people. don't know, just a thought.

well, thanks, all!

momof2n2 · Post by **momof2n2** » Wed May 21, 2008 11:59 am

Carrie,

Today when I was reading Mr. Popper's Penguins to the kids I was very aware of the vocabulary, given the question I posted earlier in the morning. There were a handful of words I am confident my boys did not know the meanings of, yet my son only stopped me once, to ask me to define "tripod." So - I think what works best for us is if he stops me to ASK for a word. I'd hate to have him hung up on trying to figure it out and not listening, or if I'd told him ahead of time not to interrupt, would he then be ruminating on, "I have to remember that word to ask. I have to remember that word to ask."

Vocabulary is a funny thing to me, as I recently discovered that while he can spell 100% on his tests, etc., it doesn't phase him at all when he doesn't know the meaning of the words!!! Yet, he will regularly ask me for the meanings of words when he is reading in the car or something. It must only matter to him, um, when it matters to HIM!

Thanks for more information on CM way.
Stacy

Tiffini · Post by **Tiffini** » Wed May 21, 2008 12:25 pm

Along this vein of thought, I have found it to be very helpful for me personally to read the book A Charlotte Mason Companion by Karen Andreola. It has really helped me in understanding CM's philosophies and why she held them. I like to know WHY I am doing something, rather than just doing it because I was told that it is the best way. Reading this book helped me quite a bit with that - and it explains those very things that this thread is about and that Carrie so eloquently explained in her posts as well.

Melanie · Post by **Melanie** » Wed May 21, 2008 12:48 pm

annegirl1919 wrote: i have only done two years of homeschool. lhth-which was a wonderful, well loved success, and mfwk which was received with much less enthusiasm, and we cut 1/2 of it out because she would have been miserable and it would have just been a fight the whole year.

I'm not trying to be nosy, but I don't think I would jump from doing half of MFW K right into Bigger. Maybe Little Hearts or Beyond would be a better fit. That could be why the history seems too hard. When I finished MFW K with my kiddos, we went right into Little Hearts with great success.

Tiffini - I love that book as well and I agree...it does help to understand the "whys" and "hows" of the CM philosophy before you jump into it.

Stacey - that is soooo true!! My kids are that same way. It has to be "personal" to be important, and I must confess....I'm that way too.

annegirl1919 · Post by **annegirl1919** » Wed May 21, 2008 2:26 pm

melanie, actually, we are about finished with mfwk, and i'm just being a super planner.

we have beyond here at home to begin in july. i'm just thinking and planning for next year. (i like to mull over my options for awhile in advance. then buy whatever i am going to use in the early spring to pour over it and organize and plan.) sorry for the confusion.

Melanie · Post by **Melanie** » Wed May 21, 2008 2:37 pm

oooohhh! I see...

I actually used to be that same way, so I totally understand.

Hopefully, you will love Beyond and become a Hodie for life and be able to find some peace. I've had to get some new hobbies though, since I don't have to spend so much time researching!

Of course, there are always electives to agonize over!

annegirl1919 · Post by **annegirl1919** » Wed May 21, 2008 2:44 pm

i can really see me using it forever. i used to be tempted by wp, but i don't think i could pull off all the activities. too much work and prep for my personality. i love the kind of activities in hod. sl appeals, too, but theirs never seems terribly cohesive. i like that so much of hod is tied together. it is very purposeful and has a clear point and objective. i love how hod has activities that truly target all the different learning styles. i love that i don't have to figure out if i'm getting everything covered that they need. carrie has done all that for us. seriously, i love hod. i'd really love it if it worked for us all the way through.

hope no one minds my questions and concerns as i work through it. (maybe year by year!)

my3sons · Post by **my3sons** » Wed May 21, 2008 3:11 pm

This has turned into a great discussion about CM methods and the ins/outs of those methods. Reading Carrie's and the rest of your comments here reminded me of my independent reading at home as a child. Growing up, as the youngest of 3 girls in my family, I had lots of older reading material at my fingertips. I began reading Nancy Drew, the Hardy boys, and many other books, way before I probably should have. One thing I've realized from that is I know the meanings of lots of words, but I mispronounce them sometimes.

The words that I read in these "over my head" books as a child were words that I did not know the meanings of and had no one explain them to me (obviously, since I was not supposed to be reading them yet!).

But, I managed to have a rather large vocabulary built by reading material full of many words that no one explained the meaning of to me. In fact, I often scored very high on my vocabulary tests at school, and I remember my mother looking over the words at conferences and saying she wondered how I knew any of those words at all.

I think that this is a natural thing that happens when we read living books. Words can be learned from the context in which they are read, and they are more meaningful this way. The oral narrations and discussions that Carrie has planned in the HOD guides help ensure that our children learn the correct pronunciation of words as well - which would have been beneficial to me when I was reading those older books as a child! These discussions/narrations provide an easy way to correct mispronunciations.

One of the beautiful benefits of doing the CM method is that dc learn to make their own connections to what they are reading. I too feel the urge to jump in and correct my children, or add in my own 2 cents all of the time, but then I try to remember how disinterested I became when my college professors would discuss books in this manner. The more I've read about CM, the more I've come to understand that her way of thinking is full of amazing insights that I have a natural tendency to want to undo the simplicity of by taking over and forcing a more controlling manner upon.

Every now and then, I pull out my books about CM and I try to reread a chapter or two. It's always refreshing to me, and it redirects my compass in the right direction again. HOD does a great job of making CM methods doable, manageable, and enjoyable. It's just me that gets in the way of that sometimes!

I've got a lot more to say about the CM methods used in HOD, but that's another post altogether, so I'll save it since this has already gotten long!

In Christ,
Julie

my3sons · Post by **my3sons** » Wed May 21, 2008 3:20 pm

annegirl1919 wrote:melanie, actually, we are about finished with mfwk, and i'm just being a super planner. we have beyond here at home to begin in july. i'm just thinking and planning for next year. (i like to mull over my options for awhile in advance. then buy whatever i am going to use in the early spring to pour over it and organize and plan.) sorry for the confusion.

Anne - I can totally relate to planning ahead here! I do the same thing, and love to think of what's to come, even far down the road!

annegirl1919 wrote:i can really see me using it forever. i used to be tempted by wp, but i don't think i could pull off all the activities. too much work and prep for my personality. i love the kind of activities in hod. sl appeals, too, but theirs never seems terribly cohesive. i like that so much of hod is tied together. it is very purposeful and has a clear point and objective. i love how hod has activities that truly target all the different learning styles. i love that i don't have to figure out if i'm getting everything covered that they need. carrie has done all that for us. seriously, i love hod. i'd really love it if it worked for us all the way through. )

I love HOD for all of the reasons you mentioned here, and it is such a relief to have Carrie do all the work for us, isn't it? I enjoy having my time be spent teaching my children, rather than planning. I do enjoy planning, but I do not have the time (nor Carrie's talent) to do it anymore.

I'll be doing Beyond... along with you next year, so that will be fun to share with one another.

In Christ,
Julie