CM method still not 'clicking' with my daughter!

[striving2Bprov31]

Well, I've been educating my kids CM style for two years now. I've been using HOD off and on during that time, but have been using HOD faithfully for about 6 months. It's just working great with my kids!! My boys are just thriving on the methods used in HOD. My daughter loves so many aspects of CtC....the science, the art and poetry, the Bible time, the notebooking, etc. BUT......I've been thinking for quite awhile that CM just does not fit her learning style. I've started reading a book on learning styles and the more I read the more I am realizing this about my daughter. I don't need to bore you with all of the details about her learning style, but I have to admit I have been so disappointed that CM doesn't seem to work with her. She is just not thriving and meeting some of the academic goals we had in mind. The fact that our boys are meeting the goals and growing not just spiritually but academically tells me that I am probably dealing with a child who just may not fit with CM.

So....I've been just trying to come to terms with the fact that I may have to change a few things around for her. Like using language arts that is more tradional and approaching history from a more traditional standpoint. She does do very well reading bioagraphies and historical fiction for history.

I will mention an interesting point...she was in christian school during her younger elementary years and she just thrived on textbooks, quizzes and tests!! She mentioned awhile back that she would love to take tests again!! Go figure. She just loves the structure of workbooks, always has.

Anyway, some comfort would be appreciated!! I just don't want to take her out of HOD completely, its just so awesome, and she does well with some aspects of it!!

I know this is not a curriculum problem, but its about me finding what fits her learning style.

Help??
Thanks!

[psreit]

I'm not familiar with all that the upper guides include, but you could give tests with Math and maybe even English. You could still have her read the books listed in HOD. As far as Science and History, I think the living book approach is so much more interesting than the textbooks. I wouldn't eliminate books from HOD. I would just try to add some tests wherever possible. Just my opinion.

[raceNzanesmom]

I agree with Pam. You can add math tests, quizzes, etc if that's what she thrives on. R&S has tests and additional worksheet booklets you can buy. You can add to subjects with additional writing, research, etc.

I'm not sure what part of HOD you don't feel she's getting. Perhaps you could give some details. HOD is very rich and can easily be adjusted for learning styles.

[Carrie]

Liz,

You have such a gracious manner in your speech! It is a blessing to dialogue with you about your kiddos! As I was pondering what you shared about your daughter, I was remembering some of our previous talks about her. In thinking back to a few of our previous discussions, I'm thinking that your daughter was struggling with the load of CTC (especially the readings in history) when you began it with her about 6 months ago. I know we talked about dropping CTC down to half-speed or else backing her up a guide to get the right fit. With this in mind, I still feel it is more likely that she is struggling with the transition and the fit than anything else. I'm not sure if you're still going half-speed with her, or if she's been able to take over her own readings now in all areas and doing all things meant to be independent. But, we truly want kiddos to thrive in their placement and be able to do what we're asking them to do fairly easily. At this point, I'd be inclined to really ponder backing her up a level to find the right fit. The difference the right fit makes is huge!

Learning-style wise, we do address all learning styles within our guides within every day of plans, so matter what learning style your child is... there will be something in that style each day. Language arts wise we are very traditional, using Rod and Staff for grammar and DITHR for literature instruction. We use a formal writing program in the guides from CTC on up. The only place we vary from traditional language arts is with studied dictation rather than formal spelling lists. So, you can't really find a more traditional language arts.

As far as CM goes, I fully agree that there is a time of transition into truly reaping the benefits from that philosophy. The transition from a textbook style education toward a CM-style education is a process, but it well worth the patience to see it come to fruition. I'll share a link where I discuss the process of changing from a textbook focus to a CM focus and why it takes time. Link: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=7447

I have been wondering how your sweet daughter was progressing after our last discussions, so it's good to have an update. From what you've shared so far, I'd still be inclined to consider moving her to Preparing Hearts instead. I think that in the long haul she will be better placed and the material will fit her better than if you continue to press on with difficulty. This could be much of the reason that she is longing to go back to what is more comfortable. I honestly think it is more about placement than about method right now. We hear from so many moms that once the placement is right everything goes better!

Those who typically struggle with a more CM-style education are often either placed in a level too far above them (content and reading level-wise) or they are just coming from a textbook style education and needing a time of transition. At this point, after 6 months, if your sweetie was able to be doing the guide exactly as written and the fit was right, you'd be seeing the fruit of the CM philosophy.

I know it can be tough to ponder a change, but it sounds as if you are pondering a change anyway. I want your daughter to enjoy her school and her material! I'd be so sad to see her return to textbooks and miss out on the richness of a CM-style education. The textbooks today are written at a much lower reading level than grade level texts used to be, so they are much less work to read and simply an easier reading level. You could get this same effect by backing down a guide, which will give an easier reading level and be a better stepping stone to the harder material to come. The Story of the Ancient World is a tough text, requiring a strong reader. The volume of material within CTC is also quite a jump up from Preparing. I think your daughter would thoroughly enjoy the books within Preparing Hearts and find her school day more manageable. This is the route I would really ponder right now for her.

Blessings,
Carrie

[striving2Bprov31]

Thank you all so much for taking time to respond to this issue. Thank you so much, Carrie, as I can imagine how very busy you are!! It was hard for me to start this thread, as I do not want my issue to make it seem like there is something wrong with HOD curriculum!

Well, I am going to list what is working well for my dd with CtC, and what is not working out so well. But first I wanted to mention a few things that you pointed out, Carrie. You made many excellent points that I had not thought of. The first thing that jumped out at me is how you said that the transition to CM will be difficult for a student when the material is too challenging. Yes, I see how true this is. You also mentioned how Story of the Ancient World is a difficult read, and another 'yes' on that one! My daughter's struggle with this book has perplexed me over the last months because she is a very strong reader. I just don't understand why this book won't engage her, and the reading comprehension is just NOT happening with this book. That has really robbed her of enjoying this book, and even though she enjoys all of the activities that springboard from the history reading, I feel like even those lose something because of the history reading comprehension problems. At this point I do feel like a switch to Preparing is probably what is needed. I would sure like that better than switching over to a few textbooks!!!! Also, Carrie, like you said, I want her to enjoy her schoolwork, too. Especially history...my belief is that history is a subject that should be enjoyed by all.

Anyway, on to my list...... Thank you for reading this far, haha.

What IS working well.....

-Independent History Box, all assingments
-Bible Quiet Time
-Storytime Box
-Science Box, all assignments
-Poetry assignments and painting
-History projects
-Bible study/Geography Box
-Math
-Following independent directions- going well
-DITHOR
-Write with the Best

What is not working so well....

-History Reading-Story of the Ancient World, Probably is her biggest overall struggle with the things that aren't working
-Written Narration-have seen some growth in her but not enough
-Dictation, just not making progress in spelling, but she is a very natural speller, don't know what the deal is
-Rod and Staff Book (I love it, but she is just not moving forward or "getting it" with grammar

Anyway, there you go. Maybe with this little bit of detail, you ladies can shed some more light on the subject!!
Preparing may just be the way to go. The reason I haven't switched her yet is-as you can see by the list-MOST of the elements of CtC are going just fine. I know she would be sad to have to step away from Diana Waring CD and the painting and the notebook pages.

Thanks again!
PS- Carrie thank you for saying that my speech has a gracious manner!! That just means that, thank the Lord, maybe Jesus is shining through this yucky old sinful flesh of mine that I will be rid of someday!

[cirons]

Hi Liz,

It sounds like the few things you mentioned she is struggling with are boxes/skills that normally take a while to progress in anyway. I have read comments from other ladies saying the narrations and dictation are skills that can take a year or so to see results in and for children to get used to.

I have a daughter that sounds similar to you in that she enjoys the 'school text book' style of learning. I don't know if this helps at all, but I have found my daughter is very black and white. She enjoys knowing something is right or wrong. She also has a love language which is strong in 'words of affirmation' and I think seeing how well she goes in tests/worksheets etc is like a 'top up' for her love tank because it is like someone saying 'great job, you did awesome!'. There is not the same black and white feedback in CM style learning and it is more up to me to encourage her the way she needs encouraging, and I am not always very good at remembering to do this!!! I have had to find ways to encourage her by acknowledging her beautiful handwriting, or giving her a sticker every 10 dictations she gets correct in a row, or stamping her maths books when she gets all her answers correct, and praising her beautiful pictures/notebook work to my husband when he gets home etc.

All the best as you process this,

Blessings,

Corrie

[LynnH]

Your dd sounds similar to my ds. He finds workbooks much easier than the CM way, but I think it is because he doesn't have to push his thinking to the next level. I think it is important that he learn to do that so we press on with HOD, plus he loves it, even if sometimes he gets frustrated when I push him to go beyond his "just the facts" way of thinking.
I will say that Story of the Ancient World was also very tough for my ds to narrate. Towards the end of the book he seemed to get the flow of it better. The other two books were easier and then at the end they move in to reading the bible and that went very well. We have done 2 years of HOD after coming from public school and it is still a chore to get him to think in a CM way. What I can say is yes he did well with the black and white answers of worksheets and test, but his retention even 2 weeks later was not there. For the dictation do you have her write any of the bold words, or any places where there is punctuation on a white board first? Julie suggested that and it has helped tremendously with my ds. As far as written narration I realized I had to stop comparing him to wonderful written narrations I saw on here or how my dd would have done it. I had to be very objective and see if he was doing the things that were required and I realized he was. He is not a detailed oriented kid and he is not one to write with fancy language. He was using his own style and using some of the authors voice as well and he was sequencing the events and hitting the main topics, which is what I told him I wanted him to do. He is slowly adding more flavor to his written narrations, but it is taking time.

[Carrie]

Liz,

Aren't the ladies on this board wonderfully helpful and enouraging! I am blessed every time I read a post on the board with such wise counsel. I am sorry it took me a bit to get back to you, but one thing for me that is key as I'm thinking about your daughter in particular is that she hasn't been through Preparing Hearts. While Preparing isn't a prerequisite to heading into CTC on up, it does truly help to go through it first for more teaching and practice in the skills to come after it. So, if a child is on the borderline between two programs, I will almost always lean toward the easier program.

So, while you could journey on with CTC as some parts are working well for your daughter, I would be more hesistant to recommend that path as in the long haul it is likely the guides will always be on the quite difficult side. I always weigh when talking through options with families how a child can be most successful in the long-run. In your case, since your daughter has never done Preparing Hearts, it makes good sense to stop and make the switch thinking of it as helping her find the best fit for years to come.

If you do Preparing as written at full-speed, then when you head back into CTC, I'd just have your daughter save her notebook and books and just pick up right where she left off in CTC. In that way, no time has been wasted, nothing has to be repeated, and she gets a jump-start forward.

Anyway, those are my thoughts. Feel free to share yours.

Blessings,
Carrie