MUS vs Singapore...rather long

[annaz]

My dd was math phobic when we switched to MUS Primer, everything changed. She "got it" and it was good. We came from Rightstart, which was bizarre, no counting, seeing it, and it stressed her out to tears. A bazillion different counters that she wasn't aloud to count. MUS fixed her. She understood place value because unlike Rightstart, they started at the very, very beginning with the understanding of math.

With that said, I am reading all these cute things to do for Math in Beyond. But it's Singapore math. Whaaaaa.....we want to do all the cute little things too, but I've heard that Singapore is hard to teach because like Rightstart, it's "different". It's not the way us old farts learned. Unlike Rightstart, Singapore is mastery, right? MUS is mastery as well. Spiral drives me batty. With that said, will I ever need to "teach" Singapore when I use HOD? Doesn't Carrie do her own little blurb of things then have them complete a worksheet? I mean we don't need the teacher's manual for Singapore. And when or if Carrie doesn't continue Singapore around 5 or 6 a/b it'll be a moot point, right?

I know you can't tell me what to do, but if switched to Singapore (of course I just ordered MUS Alpha) do you think I may freak? I mean math is NOT my area. But we want to have fun too and simplify our homeschooling. I thought I may save MUS Alpha in case we get to a point we don't "understand" in Singapore. MUS has this way of making you understand math as opposed to just doing it. But because Singapore was cheap...couple workbooks, I ordered it to try and so far in the last few days my dd's enjoyed Carrie's little explorations. My thoughts are to do Sinapore, but keep MUS just in case we need that safety net. Dumb? Thoughts?

[Melanie]

I'm cracking up at your post....I love RightStart!!

We are also doing a trial run through MUS alpha now, and we like it as well, but we loved Rightstart.

I've looked at the placement tests for Singapore b/c of the fact that I am loving HOD so much, I thought, hey...why not just go whole hog? The programs look very, very similar to me...both based on the asian way of doing math, and both focus on mental math and problem solving, etc.

There may, however, be something very different in the way it is presented in Singapore that would make it a fit for you, though. I do not know if it is spiral or mastery...for some reason I thought someone on here said it was spiral?

RightStart does have a learning curve, but we are a very "math-y" family and I absolutely love the way topics are approached. I think that's why there are so many different math programs on the market...we all have to find what floats our boat!

Good luck Ann! Your posts always make me feel like you're sitting in my living room talking to me and you had me laughing with this one!

[annaz]

I'm cracking up at your post....I love RightStart!!

We are also doing a trial run through MUS alpha now, and we like it as well, but we loved Rightstart.

I've looked at the placement tests for Singapore b/c of the fact that I am loving HOD so much, I thought, hey...why not just go whole hog? The programs look very, very similar to me...both based on the asian way of doing math, and both focus on mental math and problem solving, etc.

There may, however, be something very different in the way it is presented in Singapore that would make it a fit for you, though. I do not know if it is spiral or mastery...for some reason I thought someone on here said it was spiral?

RightStart does have a learning curve, but we are a very "math-y" family and I absolutely love the way topics are approached. I think that's why there are so many different math programs on the market...we all have to find what floats our boat!

Good luck Ann! Your posts always make me feel like you're sitting in my living room talking to me and you had me laughing with this one!

Oh Melanie... That's 'cuz you GET math. I never knew why I was supposed to carry that little "1" or drop that "0" in multiplication. I never got the connection until I went to a MUS seminar. Okay and now you're all asking, "why in the world is she homeschooling?" Rightstart, you love it or hate it. Even I hated it, even though we plugged and dragged through it. Give you a great deal on manipulatives, Melanie........................

See, I'm with you! Why NOT go whole hog? And yes, I'm still obsessing on my phonics/LA. I almost sent you an email on it again to see how it was going, but no! I decided to obsess on math today instead. UGH...... But see with the Singapore lessons Carrie is my TM!!!! And if I don't ever need the TM with Singapore, then I don't have to stress on "getting" it, right?

[shera]

Ann
I have Singapore 1a/1b if you want to look at it. I also know they have textbooks, "intensive practice" and challenging word problems. Those would help to reinforce.

Let me know
Sarah

[Vicki]

I can't comment on which is better for your child than the other, but I can only speak from my experience. I ordered MUS Alpha two years ago after reading lots of raves about it. At first it was great, and we had fun with it. It soon turned into a bit of drudgery as we couldn't move forward until a certain set of facts was mastered. You can only do the "2's" and "3's" so many times, then it gets really boring. So that's the way MUS went in our house.

I now use a program that is very Singapore-"like", and it is working great for us. The thing that thrills me also is that the math activities that Carrie has written into the guide work hand-in-hand with the lessons we are working through in our program right now.

All that said, I have found that at an early age, exploration with the manipulatives works wonders for making connections. All kinds of manipulatives--glass stones from the Dollar Tree are our current favorite, but we also use those little conversation hearts at Valentine's time, acorns from the yard, M & M's, etc.--those things helps so much!

I don't think it's so much a matter of "this program vs. that program", but really a "what is it that helps turn those wheels in your child's mind when you present it" kind of thing, KWIM? I just know that the day we started working with the program we use now, I could really kind of see those little gears working in his brain, and a little light bulb came on. That's when I knew that no matter, we found what worked, and we were sticking with it. I hope that you can find something that will give you peace in your decision about math. At this age, it's really just a matter of lots of different "roads" (approaches) to get where you want to go, but they all get there eventually~right?

[Kathleen]

Ann,

I don't know if this affects your decision or not, but the activities in the manual stop with level 3A. Just thought I'd let you know. From 3A on the kids use the text book and workbook. (They're both inexpensive.) Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, but I'm pretty sure that I read that somewhere when I was first looking into Bigger.

I haven't used Singapore yet, but will start soon. We're finishing up our Saxon math this week. We like Saxon, but it takes way too much of our time. I'm looking forward to trying Singapore!

Kathleen

[netpea]

Hi, well here's my experience with Singapore for my son.

We did LHFHG as 1st grade, Beyond was being written at the time. Ds did Singapore 1A/1B with few activities. We did some of the ones in LHFHG but they are targeted at Earlybird math. He did just fine. It is somewhat different than how I learned math, but he got it, and it wasn't hard to teach.

We skipped a year doing MFW and FIAR and didn't get far into 2A when it got too hard for my boy (who was only 6) so we did the Total Math grade 2 book from Walmart.

At 7 we started Beyond and went back to 2A using the activities from Bigger. We don't always remember to do them but he likes them and they do help.

All this to say that I am happy with Singapore math and just started using Earlybird 2A with my dd(5). I've never tried MUS or Rightstart so I don't know about them but my son is able to do math in his head quite well with Singapore, although he doesn't have many math facts memorized, he figures it out every time.

[inHistiming]

We used Singapore 1A and 1B for 1st grade and I was happy with it. The lessons were easy and my dd did well. We did not use it this year because I had Horizons 2 sitting on my shelf from a year we switched Math curriculum for my son. She has done very well with this also, but we are going back to Singapore for 3rd grade. Our son is also switching, so ALL children will be in Singapore at varying levels. It is inexpensive, even when you get to the levels that require both the textbook and workbook. Saxon is about $80 per level, and Horizons about $60. I know cost should not be the main factor, and it's not, but it is a factor. Plus, Singapore, at least the way Carrie has it scheduled, has shorter lessons, and that appeals to all of us. After looking at Singapore 3A and 3B, comparing it to Saxon 65, my husband said he thinks our son will learn better with Singapore. Other children may be different....Saxon is great, but a lot of work. DH said if he (ds) could get through it and retain it all it might be better, but the way it's laid out he thinks Singapore is the best way to go. Just our family's thoughts about Singapore!

[Hillcrest Academy]

Hi Ann

Don't know if you remember from the MFW boards, but we hated MUS. Might be because I thought you just stuck in the DVD and left the kid watching it I also don't get Math. So I was looking for a program where everything was scripted for me. Hence the MUS. But it just didn't work for us. I may give it a try in the future, but for now, we switched to Singapore.

There's something I wanted to remind you about... Ask yourself WHY you're so bad at Math, and I'm pretty sure somewhere in your answer you'll have something like "I got lost somewhere along the line at school and never got it from then on." It is for this reason that I firmly believe in mastery. When I explained the other methods to my hubby, he said "But how can you build on something that you don't understand!?". And that's how I got lost at school. They kept trying to build on something that I didn't get.

Well, the good thing for us home schooling mamas is that we get to learn everything again I am going through the Math with dd and relearning with her. That way I know that I'm at the very least at the same level as her, and we can learn the next thing together. If there's a concept we don't get, we can always ask at the Singapore boards (don't know where they are, but they have to be somewhere, right?) or any other support forum.

All that to say, don't be afraid of future years in something that's working now. If you try Singapore now, and it works, just take it one day at a time and enjoy it! When (and if) you hit the bump in the road, you can either get help with the concept, or reassess your curriculum.

Make sense?

So glad you're here - I've always loved your posts too

Take care,
~Caryn~

[Tansy]

Ok here comes Tansy asking tough retorical questions

Why can't you do the cute things in Carries manuel anyway? may be a bit more work on your part to match it up with MUS but you could..

Are you thinking about switching so its all nice and tidy? Or because it is best for your child? (I warned you it is tough retorical question )

I always wanted to use Singapore math ever since I started looking into homeschooling. It was just THE best most affordable option out there. But For my child it totally did not work!!! *sob* I tried so hard but she was just so resitant to math. If I used marshmallows one day and raisins the next day dd freaked. I eventually made my way over to MUS My dd does not get plunked in front of the DVD.. The dvd is for MOM! Now she will watch it with me. I have found I really need to model the problems for her for a day then she flies though the work. Singapore just didn't work. But MUS lessons usually only take like 8 minutes of our school day. where singapore used to take 30-45 min.

I haven't sold or tossed the singapore stuff because that may be what is best for my next dd. I really think one of the reasons so many kids struggle in math is our numbering system once my dd started using 1t1 and 1t2 for 11, 12, ect she suddenly saw the numbering pattern. We need to Change the english language!!! like that is going to happen...

[annaz]

Ok here comes Tansy asking tough retorical questions

Why can't you do the cute things in Carries manuel anyway? may be a bit more work on your part to match it up with MUS but you could..

Are you thinking about switching so its all nice and tidy? Or because it is best for your child? (I warned you it is tough retorical question )

I always wanted to use Singapore math ever since I started looking into homeschooling. It was just THE best most affordable option out there. But For my child it totally did not work!!! *sob* I tried so hard but she was just so resitant to math. If I used marshmallows one day and raisins the next day dd freaked. I eventually made my way over to MUS My dd does not get plunked in front of the DVD.. The dvd is for MOM! Now she will watch it with me. I have found I really need to model the problems for her for a day then she flies though the work. Singapore just didn't work. But MUS lessons usually only take like 8 minutes of our school day. where singapore used to take 30-45 min.

I haven't sold or tossed the singapore stuff because that may be what is best for my next dd. I really think one of the reasons so many kids struggle in math is our numbering system once my dd started using 1t1 and 1t2 for 11, 12, ect she suddenly saw the numbering pattern. We need to Change the english language!!! like that is going to happen...

Haha ...because it is nice and tidy and I like everything to be all wrapped up together if I can! And how will I know if I don't try?

I too liked the look of Singapore, but Rightstart scared me because it so didn't work. I like MUS and I don't either plunk her in front of the DVD and walk a way. I view it then we view it together if I think I can't make sense (yes, even in Primer). I love that it actually explained what the place value is and how what it actually means, like 1t2. I worry that at some point I won't get SIngapore (like Rightstart) then I'll have switched and there I am, back to square one. Right now, I think I'll keep MUS and do Singapore (after all it's only a price of a workbook) and whenever we change a thought, we'll start w/MUS.

Here's a big reason to think of switching. A friend of mine used MUS throughout with her daughter and her daughter starting college this year said, "mom don't use MUS". I guess the verbage was different, so she's having a hard time associating the verbage they're talking about math. I thought if I did Singapore that wouldn't be a worry. My dd is very hands on, and she likes crafts and anything that involves moving, of course this is why we love HOD!). I see from yesterday's lesson in Singapore, it requires some more mental thought....which I like that, but I also worry that too much will discourage her. So I may go back and forth depending on the activities. But now using both is NOT making my life simpler, is it?