MTMM for partial high school credit - our scenerio

[Tabitha]

Third time is the charm, right? Attempting this for the third time, typing faster, before my computer eats the post yet again!

Due to some family medical issues putting a huge dent into our school schedule/work load this year, I have had to go back to my dd's MTMM work and see what else I can muster up for high school credit. The year she was in this guide, she was technically between 8th-9th grade. I thought we could catch up over the course of her high school years and she'd do all 4 of the high school guides. God had other plans for us, and it's not working out like I had planned. My dd wants to graduate on time, in 2 years. To do this, her 9th grade year is light (I feel it just looks like a mess with so many partial credits). Her 10th grade year is yielding 8.5 credits, and next year looks to be 8 credits. Her senior year will be able to be a lighter, if she desires. If all continues smoothly, that bad year is in the past, buried, and done. I am hopeful! If dd decides she'd like to just continue for another year and complete the 4th HOD guide, then I'll deal with that then. As of right now it is not looking like she will choose that option, so I am planning accordingly.

Reading through all the 'beef up' MTMM threads/posts, here is what I jotted down for what can be earned credit-wise from that guide (will need to go back and assign grades for that year). Bible was mentioned to be lighter at .5 credit, etc. I am not sure about the science and I noted that concern by that credit below.

Does this work? I appreciate any input you can offer:

MTMM for partial credit:
.5 Bible
.5 Economics
.5 Gym
.5 History - American History (modern, whatever it needs to be called)
.5 English - (grammar/composition only. Working on high school level DITHOR now for the .5 Lit credit to be finished/recorded in 11th grade)
.5 Science - Chemistry (intro) - Can this be done? Her work was fab. She did not do the dvd to 'beef up' for full credit since that was not our original intent at the time)
.5 Math - Alg. 1 (completed Pre-Alg. and 1/2 Alg. 1 during this guide)
1 Music/Piano - enough hours in instruction and practice to count for full credit
.5 Music/Ukulele - enough hours to count for half credit
1 Art - Monart classes (Mona Brooke franchise) - acrylics, pastels, watercolor, oil pastels, charcoal, pencil. Plus, dd has her first art work win publication in a book this year

My dd is very artistically and muscially gifted. She will be earning a full credit in each of these subjects for each year of high school. 10th grade gave her 2 more art work publications. She participated in 2 recitals for each of her instruments, had 2 casual coffee shop recitals, and was the live entertainment for 2+ hours at her art show open house. She desires to pursue something in art (maybe incorp music as well), and at this time is not too thrilled over taking more general courses in college. She may just do a certificate program somewhere...workshops...or go off on her own. The Lord is slowly opening various doors for her. All we can do is pray as we watch it all unfold before us. If she does decide to attend college, I definitely want to show her art/music track/emphasis on her transcript.

Thank you again for any input.

[StephanieU]

What does your state require for graduation? Mark off the credits you know she will earn for 10th-12th grades, and then see what is left. Although she may "earn" art credits each year, I know often that only a few will really count as many states cap certain subject credit counts (I know they capped PE when I was in school for example).

[Tabitha]

Hmmm...I hadn't thought of looking at 10-12th and plugging into 9th whatever is needed there to round things out. I worried about the sparse 9th grade year on the transcript. Am I worrying too much? Using a transcription service is looking pretty nice right about now.

I have never heard anyone mentioning a cap by the state on credits here. Looking at the info from the school local high school site, they mention their students taking an additional 7 credits via electives (shown at very bottom of this post). No cap mentioned for a single area. I would need to look into this further to see how it applies to us. It would certainly mean no four years of art and music, but I would use those for electives up to the max that I could (and combine instruments together). It may also mean that we don't use many more of the electives via HOD after this year as well. What I do know is that by the state there are only 16 required subject specified credits. Above that I could really do whatever I wanted, right (minding any potential cap on one subject)?

I talked to dh a little tonight about thoughts on dd doing an extra year, despite her saying before she didn't want to. It's not an option that sits well with me. I'd struggle with feeling like I am punishing her by 'holding her back' a year because of family issues, medical stuff, etc. that are certainly not her fault. I feel that stress should fall on me.... Dh suggested I mention it to her again. Maybe she'll reconsider it. I'll discuss it with her again. Still, not a hit with me even though it would make figuring out the transcript and having things for a portfolio much easier. The push for getting in more Lit with DITHOR on top of schooling all summer is taking a toll on her. She's tired and stressing. She's feeling me, and I am trying hard for her not to do that.

Our local high school website has the best layout for the state guidelines, alongside their info for what else the school system requires. I usually use this info, mainly the 'alt' wording below. The state requirements (Michigan Merit) are listed near the end.

* * * * *

Graduation Requirements:
High School Level

For the official records, student class placement will be determined in the following manner:
Less than six (6) credits - Freshman
Six (6) credits to less than twelve (12) credits with four (4) credits of Michigan Merit Credit = Sophomore
Twelve (12) credits to less than seventeen (17) credits with nine (9) credits of Michigan Merit Credit = Junior
Seventeen (17) credits to twenty-three (23) credits with twelve (12) credits of Michigan Merit Credit = Senior

GRADUATION REQUIREMENT Table:






Dearborn Public Schools require twenty-three (23) credits for graduation. The Michigan Merit Curriculum requires sixteen (16) credits for graduation, which could be acquired through subject and integrated (mixed subject) classes, as well as, career and technical education programs. The Board has designated listed curriculum as required for graduation.

Graduation Requirements- Another view
LANG. ARTS (8 semesters) SOCIAL STUDIES (6 semesters) SCIENCE (6 semesters) MATHEMATICS (8 semesters)

9th Grade: LANG ARTS 1-2 WORLD HISTORY 1, 2 BIOLOGY ALGEBRA I
10th Grade: LANG ARTS 3-4 US HISTORY 1, 2 CHEMISTRY or PHYSICS GEOMETRY
11th Grade: LANG ARTS 5-6 US ECONOMICS ELECTIVE SCIENCE ALGEBRA II
12th Grade: LANG ARTS 7-8 US GOVERNMENT SENIOR YEAR MATH
WORLD LANGUAGE (4 semesters)VPA ART (2 semesters) Computer Applications Online Learning Experience

Arabic, French, German, Any visual, performing.or applied arts electives 1 semester of MS or HS 20 hours
Spanish or American Sign Language computer applications
2 years of the same world language
PHYSICAL EDUCATION (2 semesters)
PE 9 / HEALTH

Michigan Merit Curriculum Graduation Requirements:

4 Credits – Mathematics including the equivalent of algebra I, geometry, the entire algebra II content taken either in one or two full years with one (1) math or math-related class taken in the final year of high school.
4 Credits – English Language Arts aligned with subject area content expectations
3 Credits – Science, including biology, physics or chemistry; one (1) additional science credit
3 Credits – Social Studies, including .5 credit in US civics/US government, .5 credit in US economics; 1.0 credit US history, 1.0 credit world history/geography
1 Credit – Physical education/health credit
1 Credit – Visual, performing, applied arts credit
On-line learning experience

Students shall receive high school credit for high school level classes taken at the middle school if the courses are identical to the high school courses and have been awarded high school credit.

Beginning with the class of 2016, students will need to complete two (2) credits of a single world language in grades 9-12; OR have an equivalent learning experience in grades K-12.

Additional Dearborn Public School requirements:

7 Credits – In addition to the credits outlined above, credit hours in electives, or career and technical education programs must be completed and awarded.

Computer Applications taken either in middle school, high school, or successful test out

[mom2samlibby]

I would give a full credit for history. If you did math everyday, I'd also give a full credit for the algebra.

[rumkimom]

Wow...I did not realize that MI has that specific of requirements. Is this what the public school says or what the law says? Just asking because this is what NY state laws requires for grades nine though twelve: "English (four units); Social studies (four units) which includes one unit of American history, one-half unit in participation in government, and one half unit economics; mathematics (two units); science (two units); art and/or music (one unit); health education (one-half unit); physical education (two units) and three units of electives." Also "one unit is equal to 6,480 min of instruction" (108 hours).

[Tabitha]

Thank you for the advice.

Going by Carrie's info in the various beef-up posts, you need to combine histories from Rev to Rev and MTMM to be able to get a full credit in American History. My dd skipped the Rev to Rev guide, so only had one part of the history.

Anyone know differently on this? I'll go look up posts again for this info.

For math, we have run into a kink. Dd completed two Pre-Alg programs (TT and Math Essentials) and two Alg. 1 (No-Nonsense and CTC). I was having her do some CTC Alg to fill in any gaps from No-Nonsense since Carrie stated that is a weaker Alg. program, and also to give her more confidence in her ability. I was trying to move dd over to Carrie's math recommends hoping for a smooth transition into whatever Alg. 2 recommend followed. DH had taken over math and was helping dd, and they just kept moving on with the CTC lessons. Somewhere along the way, the CTC Alg. started getting more difficult. At first dd was fine, then she needed some help from dad. Then it turned to always needing dad, and he started going nuts and digging out his College Algebra books to aid them in the lessons. The way the info was presented, they had to dig into his college books to find out how to decipher the info to know what equation they needed to work the problem. He says the math they are doing is more advanced. Being an Electrical Engineering Program Manager, he deals with math daily in his job. If this has him getting frustrated, I had to listen and try to figure out what's going on. Contacting CTC, they won't comment on a level that this Alg. goes through (hitting intermediate/advanced, etc). They just say to do more lessons and also go back and do more Pre-Alg. Dh is done. No more Alg. He feels this is way beyond Alg. 1. Dd shared that a lot of what she has been covering with CTC was not the same as what the No-Nonsense Alg. contained.

So, I have no clue what to put down for her math for 10th grade. She did more Alg. 1, plus something that falls beyond and I don't know what to call it. DH is searching online and he places it as part Alg. 2. I search for keywords dd and dh mention from the lesson work, and I come up with Intermediate Algebra, Complete Algebra courses, etc. It's frustrating.

We borrowed a friend's Saxon Alg. 1 text and dh is going to look through that for comparison. Looking at scope and sequences for other math programs, since section titles are quite different, it's hard to know what is covered without seeing the actual text. Looking at the TT placement test for Alg. 2, dd knows all that info. I thought about having dd just go right into Alg. 2, but she is tired of Alg. atm and wants something different. Dh feels the same way for her.

We are moving dd onto Geometry: A Guided Inquiry. If this program isn't her style, we'll be going back to TT and just finish her maths up with them. I am regretting ever straying from them right now.

In the meantime, I need to find a good resources with examples of intermediate and advanced algebra for dh to browse to help us figure what to put down for her math.

So, that is my math dilemma. That is why I was leaning towards putting down .5 credit in 9th, .5 credit in 10th. I feel it's not enough credit for the work she did, but if I can't find something helping me know what to call what she did I don't know what else to do. Our state requires 4 math credits:

Mathematics including the equivalent of algebra I, geometry, the entire algebra II content taken either in one or two full years with one (1) math or math-related class taken in the final year of high school.

I don't know if they allow Pre-Alg. to count in 9th. If they do, that can certainly be 1 credit for 9th, and 1 credit for Alg. 1 for 10th, 1 credit Geometry for 11th. Then Alg. 2 can ways happen her senior year...unless I am reading into the requirement wording wrong and she definitely needs an additional math (like Business Math as someone suggested before...unless Personal Finance counts for a math vs. an elective, as we already have that in the plans).

[Tabitha]

I would give a full credit for history. If you did math everyday, I'd also give a full credit for the algebra.

Ahhh. You gals give nice food for thought here. You sent me searching for more math info.

Digging through some of the State pdfs on grad. requirements, I found that I can give a full credit in Math for the Pre-Algebra. Alg. 2 will be her senior year math and we just need to make sure it is covered in full in a years time, and not over two years like some do.

I learn something new every time you gals mention a suggestion. Thank you!

I also found where the State mentions calling a course Algebra 2 Prep. If anything, if the CTC Math was indeed going beyond Alg. 1 as dh feels, I can at least use the State's wording of 'Algebra 2 Prep' in her course description to reflect additional material being covered outside of Algebra 1. I feel comfortable with that descriptive wording. There could also be the possible option of 9th = Alg. 1 and 10th = Alg. 2 Prep.

[Carrie]

Tabitha,

I just wanted to pop-in and mention that you can award a full credit for the history in MTMM. At the time I wrote the older thread on beefing up MTMM, the MTMM guide was brand new. Since we were not fully into writing the high school guides at that point, nor had I gone far enough through high school with my own son to truly know what could be awarded as high school credit, we were erring on the very cautious side with our advice on how to claim high school credit.

As we have traveled further down the high school path now, and I have had to be immersed in justifying credits for transcript purposes, I can see that the MTMM history is worth a full high school credit in history. So, you can definitely claim a full credit in American History for completing MTMM. If you do desire to do so though, I would probably not claim .5 credit in Economics, but instead save that to do in a later guide. There is not enough high school level economics in MTMM to claim .5 credit in it unless you added to it. You could potentially add to the economics credit later to round it out and then award the credit in the year she finished the study.

Blessings,
Carrie

[Tabitha]

Thank you, Carrie. This info helps a ton!

For Economics in the MTMM guide, we did add to it. Dd completed the Bluestocking Guide alongside and we referenced the extra articles/readings and assignments it recommended. Is that enough to beef-up the Economics for high school credit? If not, I can continue to add to that this year with two more of the recommended titles: Economics: A Free Market Reader and Capitalism for Kids. Then that should make it credit worthy, correct? If so, I can purchase those additional titles and add that as a credit in her upcoming year. In the past dd said she would prefer to not do another full blown Economics course. I will still run by all this by her: either adding more in now or waiting to take that full course again later (having her look at what items would be used for this).

Is the MTMM Chemistry okay for counting as .5 credit when the extra dvds recommended for a full credit were not added in?

Thank you again for everything, Carrie!

[Carrie]

Tabitha,

If you added the Bluestocking Guide and did the articles and assignments alongside MTMM then you can award .5 credit in Economics. You do not need to add anything more to that. Hooray!

Next, as far as the chemistry goes, do you foresee your daughter doing another chemistry course in high school? Or, will this be her chemistry credit? What is she doing for science this year?

As we ponder science it helps if we consider whether she is college bound and also consider what her post high school plans may be. So, if you can share what she has done for science this year, and whether you see her headed into a science-related career that would be great! Then, we can help further!


Blessings,
Carrie

[StephanieU]

Looking at your state's science requirements, do you plan on doing the science in WG, WH, and AH1? If so, I wouldn't count the science in MtMM as 0.5 credits of chemistry. I would count it as a full credit of elective science. Then you would have 1 credit of IPC (also elective), 1 credit biology, and 1 credit chemistry. If you aren't going to complete the chemistry in AH1, then I might claim 0.5 credits in MtMM and 0.5 credits in WG for chemistry. Then claim 0.5 credits of elective in MtMM (creation vs evolution) and 0.5 credits elective in WG (physics). Doing chemistry in AH1 is definitely the stronger option, but the other option is definitely enough for someone wanting to steer clear of STEM fields after high school.

[Tabitha]

Thank you, Carrie. Dd will be pleased to have Economics count for her. Mommy is also a bit relieved!

Right now we are close to finishing up the WG guide. Her science for this year has been the IPC + lab. For the WH guide, she will be doing the biology + DVDs + labs. We are going to join up with a friend and have our two girls work the real life labs together so they can get the hands-on dissection and microscope experience. For her last year using the AH1 guide, I was intending on her taking the chemistry for science. She really enjoyed the chemistry in MTMM, so I am hoping she enjoys taking it again with this guide.

So, her 3 sciences for high school would be the IPC, biology and chemistry. Our state only requires 2 specified sciences (biology and chem/physics) + 1 elective. Since chemistry is in the plans as a full credit for her senior year, I guess it's not worth putting anything down for 9th grade. I felt a bit odd not having a science showing for that year on her transcript. While not ideal, is it okay to have that missing for 9th grade?

Or, maybe, something dd (and the whole family) experienced could count as a .5 credit science elective? One really fun, and I feel totally rare, science experience we did have that year was the care of a 4th generation Monarch butterfly! Yes, we rescued a Monarch that could not fly due to a thoracic injury. We named him "Mark." We had him for almost 5 months. He lived in a habitat in my dd's bedroom. He kept her up so many nights as he climbed up the mesh walls of the habitat. It is amazing how loud their little claws can be. It was so neat to observe him during feedings, seeing how he reacted to his food being refreshed (we made his food), seeing how he reacted to the camera flash, allowing him to crawl over our hands, arms, bed, school room table, etc. We took him camping in the trailer with us, brought him out to meet everyone during holiday celebrations. We even had him out to be a part of the ball dropping for New Years. Silly, but fun! Funny thing is dh held him twice. Each time he pooped on dh. He never went to the bathroom on the girls or me. We took a ton of pictures and video of him. Dd made a watercolor painting of him. I am hopeful that one day we will write a little book on him. I feel it was a true blessing to be able to have this experience with Mark!

We are unsure what dd will do for college. At this time her interests don't point to a science or math related field. While that could change, I doubt it will. She is interested in art and music. Her interests are in pursuing Storyboarding, and perhaps pulling music into something along that realm. She has thoughts of developing her own cartoon. She also has mentioned being able to teach others to play the instruments she has learned, but not in the realm of going to college to learn to teach music. She also enjoys writing her own music for songs she can't find music for. She may very well be one who continues to self-learn and forgoes college, finding ways to seek work around her art/music passions. Along this line is also the possibility of starting her own business.

In addition, there is one college by us that started a new music degree due to the film studios opening up in Detroit. The field is all about music for films, writing smaller pieces, etc. When I shared this with her a year ago, she wasn't interested. Just last week, mentioning it again, she was a bit curious. This may end up being an option in the music realm, if she doesn't pursue the Storyboarding.

[StephanieU]

I would put the science in MtMM down as an elective. She did do science, and some colleges might like to see that listed. I just wouldn't count it as her official science (chemistry) credits. Some thing will go for the history. You will end up with 2 AH credits - one for MtMM and one for AH1. It is okay to have extra, and some times colleges prefer it.

[Tabitha]

I would put the science in MtMM down as an elective. She did do science, and some colleges might like to see that listed. I just wouldn't count it as her official science (chemistry) credits. Some thing will go for the history. You will end up with 2 AH credits - one for MtMM and one for AH1. It is okay to have extra, and some times colleges prefer it.

Gotcha. That makes sense. It's hard for me to decipher between what is official and what is elective. As you said, science was done and I certainly don't want anyone to think we bowed out on something when we didn't.

Reading back, her IPC science from the WG guide is for a full science credit. So, you are suggesting the MTMM chemistry as an elective at either .5 or full credit?

I am finding more peace as little things continue to fall into place.

[Carrie]

Tabitha,

I would probably lean toward naming the course for her 9th grade year something like Introduction to Chemistry, Genetics, & DNA. So, her potential high school science line-up for transcript purposes would be as follows:

Grade 9: Introduction to Chemistry, Genetics, & DNA with Lab
Grade 10: Integrated Physics and Chemistry with Lab
Grade 11: Biology (including Anatomy, & Physiology) with Lab
Grade 12: Chemistry with Lab

Blessings,
Carrie