4th grade twin boys mid-year start

[WendyTwinzMom]

I am trying to figure out what curriculum items I need to order for my kids. I have boys who are 9 (twins) and in the 4th grade. The first half of this year, we did K12 online curriculum through a virtual academy, but even though they were getting straight A grades, it was taking between 6 and 8 hours 5 days per week, which was not working for our family. I withdrew them at the beginning of last week after much prayer and many in-depth conversations with a good friend who uses HOD for homeschooling all 5 of her kids.

I want to get them started as soon as possible, but I'm not sure where to begin or what I will need to order since they are at the same level. I was looking at all the ordering options for Creation to Christ, and there are so many different things you CAN buy, but I need to know what basics we need. I'm sure there will be some curriculum items that they can share, like novels, and some that they can't, like workbooks. I am also planning to use a different math curriculum and I just need some help figuring out what to order. I have left a couple of messages on the answering machine, but haven't gotten any sort of call back. Please help!

[psreit]

Welcome! I can't help you with your CTC order, but I wanted you to know that the reason you weren't getting an answer at Heart of Dakota is that Carrie's father passed away last week. So, I'm sure they are taking some down time. They normally are quick to respond. I'm sure someone on this board can help you with your needed CTC materials. Glad to have you here.

[countrymom]

Welcome to HOD! You will want to look at the placement chart to find the best fit for your twins, http://www.heartofdakota.com/placing-your-child.php. Many families using "Preparing Hearts for His Glory" for 4th grade, so a look at the placement chart would be a good place to start. Generally if a child places between two guides you would want to go down a guide, especially if the child is new to HOD.
As for what to order, you can share many of the materials. You will need duplicate math books, and I would think two of the "Draw Through History" books might be helpful, although students don't actually draw in the books. With the DITHOR program you will want two of the student workbooks. To do everything in the guide you will want the economy, science addition, basic, and self-study history packages. You would not need the extensions. With CTC there is not a self-study package and you would need two sets of the notebooking pages. Hope that helps get you started. My best advice is placement is everything, so take a close look at the placement chart.

[Kalle]

You would want the economy package, science adder, pick one of the basic package read aloud options (history, boy, or girl), dithor if you are doing that (you would need a workbook for each child), either Building with Diligence or Following the Plan for grammar, Write with the Best, the Family Bible (or use your own), and the Bible Study in Stereo. You would need an extra student notebook from the economy package. I believe that this is what you would need. So there are only two extra consumable books that you would need. I hope to do this next year with a 5th and a 6th grader.

[StephanieU]

We haven't gotten to CtC yet (obviously), but I can do my best. One big plus of HOD is that most of the books are non-consumable. So, you don't HAVE to have doubles of most things. But, I think some families have found having doubles of some books help so the kids can do work at the same time.
So, first you need the Economy Package. In that, the consumable is the notebooking pages.
Then, assuming you want to do the HOD science, you would need the Science Adder. These are all non-consumable books.
Next is the Basic Package (or read-alouds). These you definitely only need one of, as they are what you read to the kids. You have three package options.
You don't need the extension package since they are only in the 4th grade.
Then comes the literature, math, and grammar options. If you choose to use DITHOR, each boy will need a student book. For English/grammar, you might find it easiest to get two of the pupil texts, although you can just use one and stagger when they are working on grammar (or do it together). For math, each child will need a workbook. You probably don't need two textbooks, as they are used more for teaching and reinforcing.
Finally, there is the Bible resources. The CD obviously you would only need one of. The Bible depends on if you plan on using your normal Bible or the one HOD recommends. If you are using the HOD one, you probably want two - one for each boy. Or you could get one of the "special" Bibles and let them take turns using that and a standard NIV Bible.

Maybe someone can chime in on if any of the history (economy package) or science titles it helps to have two of.

[WendyTwinzMom]

I am trying to put together an order of what I need, but it's coming out to about $770, and I'm wondering if I'm choosing too many "packs" and therefore buying some things twice. Here's what I have so far:

700A - CTC - Economy Package
700B2 - CTC - Basic Package 2: Boy Interest
700D - CTC - Science Adder
703J - CTC - Phillipians 2 CD: The Bible Study in Stereo
703I - CTC - Write With the Best
701H - CTC - Student Notebooking Pages for Creation to Christ
700B1 - CTC - Basic Package 1: History Interest
100C - DITHOR - 4/5 Package
100G - DITHOR - Level 4/5 Boy Book Pack
603H - PHFHG - Building With Diligence English 4 - Pupil's Text
603I - PHFHG - Building With Diligence English 4 - Teacher's Manual
603B - PHFHG - Primary Math 4A - Workbook

Some of this has to include duplicates... I just can't figure out what exactly is in them and what is duplicated. Is anyone else in the middle of 4th grade (9-10 years old) curriculum and can help me figure out which of these things I actually need? If not, I can wait for Carrie to get back to me. Poor thing. I had no idea her dad passed. If only I were patient...

[StephanieU]

You only need one Basic package - so either the boy or the history, but not both. Also, if you have a decent library, you can just use books in the book list that comes with DITHOR instead of buying the book pack. That will save you money.
My cart has a total of 677.56 with the following items:
1 700A - CTC - Economy Package 700A $189.99 $189.99
1 700D - CTC - Science Adder 700D $91.26 $91.26
1 700B1 - CTC - Basic Package 1: History Interest 700B1 $107.71 $107.71
1 603H - PHFHG - Building With Diligence English 4 - Pupil's Text 603H $18.45 $18.45
1 603I - PHFHG - Building With Diligence English 4 - Teacher's Manual 603I $24.95 $24.95
1 603A - PHFHG - Primary Math 4A - Textbook 603A $10.80 $10.80
2 603B - PHFHG - Primary Math 4A - Workbook 603B $10.80 $21.60
1 603C - PHFHG - Primary Math 4B - Textbook 603C $10.80 $10.80
2 603D - PHFHG - Primary Math 4B Workbook 603D $10.80 $21.60
1 703J - CTC - Phillipians 2 CD: The Bible Study in Stereo 703J $15.00 $15.00
1 701H - CTC - Student Notebooking Pages for Creation to Christ 701H $26.95 $26.95
1 703I - CTC - Write With the Best 703I $24.95 $24.95
1 100C - DITHOR - 4/5 Package 100C $84.55 $84.55
1 101B - DITHOR - Student Book 4/5 101B $28.95 $28.95

Also, before you order the Singapore books, have your boys take the placement test on the Singapore sight. Singapore doesn't follow a completely traditional sequence, so they may place into 3B, 4A, or 4B and still be on grade level.

[LynnH]

Before you order make sure that they are ready for CTC. Typically that is for 5th grade unless they have used HOD before. If they have never done written or oral narrations then jumping in at CTC will be tough. Also the history spine that they read by themselves is older language and can be very tough for kids who aren't use to that type of advanced vocabulary. HOD is a totally different style of learning than K-12. If you get CTC you will need 2 sets of notebooking pages. Also as someone mentioned they need to take the Singapore placement test. Singapore is pretty advanced.

[Tidbits of Learning]

We just came from k12 in November. My ds11 was using 5th grade k12. He completed 4th grade k12 last year. 4th grade k12 is a pretty good overview of world history and comparable to the last SOTW book. We could have started with CTC, but my ds has some writing issues and I wanted to start with PHFHG since it seemed like a good transition guide. We had used HOD before going with the k12 charter for 2 years. I would look at both sets and see if you can find an online sample for the ancients book in CTC. We did CTC for 5th and 6th with the girls and the texts are very much heavier than the texts used in Preparing. The style of HOD is very different from K12 as well and the oral and written narrations can take a bit to get used to as well. My ds was so used to being on the computer for hours of the day that he is enjoying Preparing very much especially Grandpa's box. He had completed 4th grade k12 and made all A's.
I would also recommend using the placement guide and seeing where they place with respect to written and oral narration. For 4th grade 9 yr old boys, I would probably lean towards starting them out in Preparing just b/c it is more economical for the parent, a good transition guide into HOD for boys, and it will probably start off as a bit of review for them from 4th grade k12 and finish out the year overview of world history that you started with k12. My ds actually placed in both Preparing and CTC equally as far as the placement chart but having done CTC with the girls I knew it was a guide that ramped up things in HOD.
It cost me $411 for all of the Preparing books and you wouldn't need duplicates of any books. The guides do tend to get a little more pricey the higher up you go, but I have youngers and know we will re-use almost everything. We do not use HOD Math or Language Arts. Having done k12 4th grade and CTC for 5th and 6th grade with my girls, I would really recommend that you look at Preparing as well before settling on CTC. My girls went from CTC into k12's 6th and 7th grade programs without any issues. It prepared them very well. I knew my ds was not ready for the written narrations in CTC without going through the Preparing guide so we are using Preparing for 5th with him. Another thought is the higher up with the guides you go the longer school takes. I don't know with 4th grade boys that you would be getting a much shorter day than you had with k12 with CTC. Hope some of this helps.

[my3sons]

The ladies have done an excellent job of helping here! They are such a wise group of ladies with sage advice. Honestly, it is a rare 9 yo that is ready for CTC, which is why we are all being cautious here. Unless dc have done all of HOD's plans for quite a few years before CTC, most 9 yo's place in Bigger Hearts or PHFHG. This is due to the excellent incremental teaching of skills provided in these guides, especially in the LA areas of writing, reading, dictation, and narration, as well as in the areas of gradual skill-building of following multi-step directions accurately (as in performing science experiments, completing history projects, and creating notebooking pages as higher level assessments). Likewise, independence is taught in incremental steps throughout the guides, moving dc from "T" teacher directed, to "S" semi-independent, to "I" independent in skills. For these reasons, I would love to hear about each of your twins in regard to the first page of the placement chart (reading, writing, grammar, and math). Starting in a guide that is not the right placement can cause school days to become too long, as parents have to step in and do things that were meant to be done independently - and the most difficult part of all of this? That will be a pattern you are setting for years to come, and it will be your students' first impression (as well as yours) of HOD. That is why we all want to be sure your dc are accurately placed - we want you to have an awesome start to HOD!

So, here is a link to the placement chart...
http://www.heartofdakota.com/placing-your-child.php

Here are a few more general questions...
How much are your dc used to writing each day (as in quantity and times)?
What experience do they have with dictation, oral narration, and written narration?
What are some books they are reading independently well right now, and have they had formal reading instruction?
Are they ready for diagramming in grammar, or have they already done some diagramming?

Here is a thread where the differences in CTC and PHFHG are described in detail that may be helpful...
Comparing PHFHG to CTC in Skills:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=12582&p=90658#p90658

HTH - and we'll all wait to hear back from you - we'll be glad to help with more information! Thanks!

In Christ,
Julie