Placement for 5th, 7th, and 8th graders

[HSmama3]

I am needing some assistance in deciding where to place my children. My kids are almost 12 (currently 5th grade), 13 (7th grade), and 14 (8th grade). If we make the switch, we will be switching right away and not waiting till fall. The 13 year old started school a year early with his brother and has kept up since so they are basically on the same level. I printed off the placement guide and based on that it's like they are tied for 2 programs. My 5th grader between Bigger and Preparing, and the older 2 in Res2Ref and Rev2Rev. I'm saying this based on the skills listed on the placement guide.

We have mostly used textbook/workbook style curriculum. Christian Light Educations was our main one for the 3Rs. We have tried some other programs, but always seem to end up back at CLE. They are working below grade level in their math and LA, but that is also because CLE is rather advanced concept wise. They are finishing math 600 and LA placement put them in 500. We stopped a traditional approach for every but math when we left CLE to try a more Charlotte Mason approach, but all I have found is that my kids ended up falling behind because they didn't retain much of the history, they didn't really gain much as far as grammar and punctuation from it. What they know has been from the traditional approach we've used.

The 5th grader took a little longer to start reading. He just wasn't ready when we started so I just gave him time to grow and mature while working on other skills. He does pick up things quickly, but he hasn't done much writing and still needs work to write a good paragraph. He doesn't know all of the parts of speech. He is still working on advancing to reading difficult books. He can read short chapter books independently, but guesses at words that he doesn't know. He needs to get better at spelling. He is still learning cursive. He hasn't done too much independently as far as Bible study. It's usually been together as a family. He hasn't done researching for school assignments. He knows how to look up things he's interested in finding out about, but he hasn't used that skill for school. He has done some copywork, but no written narrations. I look at the workload of Preparing and I feel it's a bit much for him.

As far as my older 2, they are pretty good readers, but still guess as words they aren't familiar with, but it's just because they haven't seen those words before. They do need to work on expanding their vocabulary, get better spelling skills, and build stamina to read more difficult books. They need more work on answering questions based on inferring information from what they read. They do know how to research things of interest, but they haven't really done it for school work. They haven't had any formal literature studies. They have done some of Christian Light Education's Reading program. They can read independently. They haven't written poetry and aren't crazy about poetry in general. They both need more work with grammar and writing such as parts of speech, punctuation, making an outline, note taking, and composing a paragraph based on their notes. They have done written narrations, but not lengthy ones. They can write paragraphs, but just write from what comes off the top of their heads. My oldest has written his own stories in a notebook, but with mostly errors in grammar, spelling, and punctuation. My middle child is good at drawing and art. They haven't done formal independent Bible study outside of maybe a Bible curriculum like CLE Bible or family study. They have already done Exploration Education's Standard science kit and I see it's scheduled in Rev2Rev. They weren't too crazy about the program so I don't think they will want or enjoy doing the Advanced kit. My middle son worked ahead, but my oldest didn't really like it. Their preference in science is zoology and human anatomy.

All of my kids are good at working independently and actually prefer it. They like knowing what to do and not have to wait for me to start on something. They all need a good overview of both World and American history since most of what they did when they were younger they forgot. They older 2 remember more American history than World. I want to be able to cover as much history as possible before they graduate. I also want them to learn the Constitution and how our government works. They all need to improve their skills in research, general, and formal writing. All 3 need vocabulary, spelling, and grammar. They aren't crazy about reading. They just want to do the bare minimum to get done and move on with their day. I am looking at HOD because I love what I see as far as skilling building. The books are scheduled in and I don't have to be coming up with my own book list and assigning them. It's easier for them to see they have to read it than have me tell them to read something. I feel that if it's in their guide, they will see they have no choice but to read the books. Even though they don't like reading, I know it's of value and importance to see the written language. I love the idea of having everything laid out and ready to go. I have looked at MFW, but feel I need more hand holding that what it offers.

I'm just not sure where to place any of them that meets their needs and my goals for them. I do not want them overwhelmed, but I don't want it too easy either. Also, how long will it take daily for them to complete their schoolwork? We do plan on sticking with CLE Math as that is something that works best for us. I'm in-between trying to decide on CLE LA or R&S English.

[Rice]

Welcome!

My suggestion is usually to pick the lower guide when undecided between two, especially when starting multiple guides; however, in your situation, I think Preparing may be better for your 5th grader. Bigger is intended to be almost completely parent-led and has 5-day units, and Preparing would give him some independence, with 4-day units, which I find easier to schedule, especially with older siblings in 4-day guides, as well. If you think the overall workload is too much for right now, I would suggest going full speed with reading, dictation, R&S (unless you stay with CLE), and Storytime (you can add in extra books before you start each new one to allow him to catch up in history to that point in the guide), as well as math, but then split the rest of the boxes to do over 2 days (or the 4-day unit over 6 days; whatever works best). Then, next fall, you could hopefully have him speed up to do a unit every 4 days. This would not put him so far behind what is ideal for placement. It would also give him a 1-year world history overview, before starting the in-depth middle school guides. It's a great place to start HOD!

As for your older two, it sounds like RTR (Resurrection to Reformation) might be better placement, though if Carrie or Julie contradict this, go with their advice! I think that EIW's Medieval History-Based Writing Lessons sound like a great fit for them in learning report writing. (It's very step-by-step and gives great guidelines my kids use into high school.) They will also love Carrie's DITHOR (Drawn Into the Heart of Reading) book sets for beginning lit analysis. You only need to do 4 genres this year (5 next to get through 9 every 2 years), so I would suggest waiting till you are in unit 4 or 5 before starting that program. Once you do one genre (15 days of reading and a 5 day project) then you can take a unit off before doing another genere, and continue that for the whole guide! RTR is probably also more manageable when it comes to starting written narrations, since Rev2Rev expects 10-14 sentences, while RTR is only 8-11. (You could start the year with the 5-8 expected in CTC for 5-10 units, then increase it as they get used to the procedure, and even take a look through the first 5 or so units of Preparing to see how Carrie teaches beginning narrations, starting with dictating aloud and copying what you scribe for them. Baby steps that will get them going on their own.)

HOD does cover the rest of what you mention, over they years: the Signers and States in Rev2Rev; Economics, Presidents and your home state in MTMM; and much more on Government, Finances, Economics, etc. through the high school guides, some of which you can pull from to do earlier than scheduled since you won't get all the guides in before they graduate. For example, I scheduled Personal Finance for my kids (scheduled in US2) in grade 11 or 12 for my kids even though they never did use the US2 guide in full.

I personally prefer R&S for my boys, as it doesn't require so much writing. However, I have used CLE for a daughter who needed independence (I was running 5 guides) and the written aspect without writing everything out, like R&S would have required. We skipped the spelling and vocabulary work in CLE (I just crossed out those exercises) because we used HOD's studied dictation for spelling and HOD's vocab, too (which is scheduled in different places in different guides). There isn't a direct correlation between R&S and CLE, however, despite them both being advanced, Anabaptist curricula, so if you decide to switch, I would strongly recommend having them take the placement test before ordering. There are definite advantages to sticking with what is working for you, especially when everything else is changing.

You are right, though, the skill-building in HOD is amazing. We came to HOD 6 1/2 years ago with my kids behind in some LA skills due to lack of direction for parents in our previous curriculum, and I no longer have that problem! The step by step, guided progression has given me the confidence I needed to teach them well in all aspects of LA.

Blessings as you decide!

[bethelmommy]

I completely agree with Rice! You can always start out at half speed, taking 2 days to complete each day until you get used to the expectations of the guide. After a few units, your children will become familiar with the routine of each guide day and you can switch to full speed.

I have loved the step-wise progression of skill building and instruction in HOD. And the kids learn to become very independent in their work.

Regarding your youngest starting Preparing, if the vocabulary assignment is too much, you can always start out with less words and build up over the course of the guide. Preparing recommends 3-5 words each week because kids coming from Bigger are already used to completing 1-3 words each week. You could always start with 1 or 2 words, and then after every 5 units or so, add an additional word to the weekly assignment until your child can complete 5 each week. The paragraph writing is introduced very gently through weekly written narrations, so I think your child will be fine there. However, focusing on helping your child to become a fluent reader will be key so he can become more independent with his schoolwork.

I also echo that if Carrie and/or Julie chime in with different advice, definitely heed what they recommend. In fact, I would probably just call HOD directly to ask for help with placement advice. Starting in the right guide goes a long way in ensuring success with HOD.

I am praying for wisdom and discernment for you in this process!

[Carrie]

Hello,

The ladies have a done such a good job of talking about possible options with you! You did a terrific job of sharing about your kiddos too. Based on what you've shared thus far, I am leaning toward having your 5th grader do Preparing Hearts and your older pair do Resurrection to Reformation or Revival to Revolution. I think both of these guide choices would do a great job of building and cementing needed skills! These guides would also nudge your kiddos forward in many needed areas simultaneously.

I would lean toward English 3 or 4 (as scheduled in Preparing Hearts) for your 5th grader and English 5 (starting at the beginning) for your older two.

If the older two enjoy independence, they will find that their days will get much more of a flow to them the further they get into the guide. This is because they will recognize and thrive with the pattern of the guide the further they go. In the beginning it may be a challenge as they adjust, so you may want to begin gradually for a few weeks.

Feel free to pop back and share your thoughts when you get a chance!

Blessings,
Carrie

[my3sons]

I enjoyed talking through placement with you on the phone earlier this week! I think the placement for your kiddos is a compilation of all of the wonderful advice given in this post! We ended up with PHFHG for the younger student and Revival to Revolution (as this guide will be used primarily for 8th and 9th grade) for the older pair. It helps so much to have this board to talk through options. It is often in the talking-through phase that what is best for each individual family's circumstances placement-wise begins to become clearer. Future goals and plans, as well as preparing for high school level work factored into the final placement as well. Thank you to all who helped talk through placement on the board! This is such an amazing place to go for help - God bless!

In Christ,
Julie

[HSmama3]

Thank you to everyone who assisted with the decision making. It was much appreciated.