Considering switching to HOD for high school..placement help

[kidsforHim]

My DS 15, 16 next by next fall, is interested in doing the World History. I'm not sure how he'd place in the writing, grammar etc.
He is using Biblioplan Ancient History now for his 9th grade earning 1 credit Bible, 1/2 credit history, 1/2 credit geography ( and another 1/4 credit from ACE geography - he did 3 of the paces). He used Step by Step for his grammar. It is intensive in diagramming and he gained a better understanding of the parts of speech. I feel good ground work was laid and put him closer, if not at, his grade. For writing, he is currently working through the last 3 paces of ACE 8th gr. English. He has done written narrations in the last 2 years of 5yr cycle MFW. Biblioplan has them writing short essay answers to 3-4 questions. For spelling he has used Phonetic Zoo and is in level C.
The world history guide has them using R & S english 7, the last half I believe? So what would we use for that since we are coming in without having done previous guide(s) I was considering just using another resource but he likes that it was all put in the plans, but we won't be able to use the plans for english anyways. We have a favorite Math we would continue. For science, I was thinking of using the WG science and combining my second DS who will be in 9th with him for their Physcial science credit. I would purchase the WG guide. DS15 is currently using Ctc for his biology credit along with Biology 101 DVD, abeka biology, and occasionally ACE biology lab dvds.
How do you think he would place?? I've even looked at Res to Ref. but I'm afraid he'd think it was too 'youngish'. He really liked the look of World History- we just maybe need to get it fine tuned for him?
I hope this all made sense, I'm short on time. Have to run for an appointment but wanted to get this out there.

[kidsforHim]

I'm not sure he would handle the work load of the world history but he could read the books & would enjoy them. I know that he could not do the 7 hr day that world history requires. It would be way too much. I don't know if it could be modified for him OR how to go about doing that.

[kidsforHim]

SO....Maybe it's not possible to come into HOD for high school if a child has never gone through the other guides???

Would it be difficult to just do the history portions or are there skills necessary to doing even that part that he wouldn't have had from not doing HOD before?? I would like to know if this a possible way to go to get in his world history credit for 10th grade. I need to plan for finance reasons.

I realize that most likely he would have to use other resources to get in his English/Lit/writing credit - that is ok.

Becky

[Jennymommy]

I'm not sure he couldn't do WH. Maybe have him do the science with brother and the Rod and Staff English 6 rather than 7. You could have both boys do the English portion of WG but use the lower level of Rod and Staff if you felt it to be necessary. This way you would be starting at the beginning of a grammar book rather than mid-way, both boys could work together on science and literature. Their history, bible, geography, library, etc. would be separate. You may want to start at a slower pave to get things stated well...no sloppy or quick work. I think you could do it and be blessed.

[Jennymommy]

Oy! Sloppy auto correct "get started at a slower pace..."

[Nealewill]

The one wonderful thing with HOD that I have found is that they include many skills into their guide, not just subject matter. So writing, spelling, grammar and reading are all balanced with each other per guide. The volume of work does increase with level and as long as your son places correctly in the placement chart for WH, then I think you will have a great year. If he doesn't place there well, then he will probably feel overwhelmed and unhappy. I would hate for you to have an unhappy year.

Jennymommy proposed a really nice thought though - having your two kids complete the grammar of R&S level 6 - the entire book over the year and doing the literature and writing selections from WG together. I am not sure of your older son's science background so you would need to see if Biology is a good fit for you or not. If not, then doing the WG curriculum and maybe adding in the Chemistry 101 DVDs may be a good fit. I am not sure of your son's math but I don't think there is a ton of math in the WG guide with the Chem 101 DVDs and the science selection books. In April I think Carrie is going to start sharing the 3rd High School Guide sneak peaks. I bet she will have a chemistry program picked out and shared with us before summer. You could definitely use that Chemistry instead of the science listed in the guide.

If your child is a strong reader and does well with lengthy weekly written narrations, then your child should probably do well with the WH guide. I think each child is very different the level of work they can complete varies immensely by children and their ages. Again, as long as your child places well in the level, then I think they will do great.

[kidsforHim]

Thank you Jennymommy & Nealewill for your thoughts!

My oldest DS is the one that is using CTC for his Biology credit this year so I was looking at putting him into WG Physical Science with labs for his Physcial Science credit. So Nealewill are you saying to do Chem 101 DVD's in place of the experiment kit in the WG? I was also considering combining the 2 boys for this Physcial Science credit that each need. I don't think my second DS would have trouble with the math calculations that are in the experiments, not sure of the oldest.
He has done several lengthy narrations but never in the way HOD has laid out in the plans. I mean, he didn't have all those steps put right out like that for him to follow, he just wrote.
So even if we're in a different level in the grammar/writing part, the "learning through history" part could still be very doable for him even without having done previous guides?
Because my oldest is using CTC for science, I've wondered if Res to Ref would be better even for history but then I look at the sample and I just feel it would be too young, and then to beef it up and all, just sounds too complicated and confusing. He liked the look of the sample I printed off of the WH- the organization of the blocks and it being all right there.
i'm conserned about the time it takes too. He has his own speed. What we are doing this year, most subjects except math would probable be considered 'light' but it can take him til 4 or so to get it all done.

[Jennymommy]

This year in WG for my ds14 has been a stretch. He does not complain, but he does work from 8-5 some days...usually day one each week, then other days he is finished by 3. However, most of his time is spent on math.....he just is slower here The WG science has gone well, and he really appreciates the ease of use provided by the guide. Hope this helps with gauging the time commitment.

[Nealewill]

If you need physical science, then no, I wouldn't change it one bit! I wasn't sure which science you needed so I was trying to offer up a few alternatives to just having physical science.

As for length of your day, HOD is still written to 4 days a week, 6.5 to 7 hours a day. If your son needs more time, he can work on the 5th day. My oldest varies regularly on time with respect to how quickly she gets her work done. A lot of it depends on whether or not she went off on a tangent while doing school. I honestly think the living library looks absolutely amazing and I am hoping to complete it with my kids, but I also know that my oldest and middle children aren't "natural" readers. They will read and they do enjoy it to some extent. But if given the choice, they don't just walk around devouring books. My thoughts on high school are that I will buy the books no matter what. My youngest is a natural book devourer so the living library will read by someone (probably her and me LOL). But I find that the other books offered are very complete and that if my oldest and middle child once in high school just can't get the living library completed, then I will probably resign to the fact that they will have 30 minutes less of reading a day. I am not necessarily recommending that you "skip" the living library because I am sure those books are absolutely fantastic. But everyone has to make their own choices. Your child's education I am sure will be very rich and full even no matter which path you choose.

As for beefing up Res to Ref - The guide actually has plans in the back for adding the extensions. If your son likes the look of the books in Res to Ref and likes hands on activities, I would consider it. I ordered in Res to Ref already and have already read several titles. I am in love! And I am 35! So I may be too old for this level but I do love it so LOL. If you son did the history work along with the extensions and read-a-louds, I am sure he would learn a ton! In addition, he would be in the next sequence of student sheets. I would add the Shakespeare study for sure. My dd already tried to snatch that book out of the box right when I opened it. She loves Shakespeare (that is one books she will devour). If you do all of these activities, your son will have an extremely full year!

[Carrie]

kidsforhim,

The ladies are doing a good job of helping you talk through options. I think at this juncture, we need a bit more information to help place your son correctly. So, when you have time, if you can look over the first page mainly of the placement charts linked below, and share with us where your son fits in each area on the first page especially that will help us advise you better. There are two sets of charts.

Link to chart for our two high school guides: http://www.heartofdakota.com/placing-yo ... school.php

Link to chart for guides prior to official high school guides (which may be a better fit, so don't overlook this chart): http://www.heartofdakota.com/placing-your-child.php

Blessings,
Carrie

[kidsforHim]

Carrie,

Ah the placement chart- I've looked at it a few times but find it difficult to know how to anwer to it. I worry I might make him what he's not, or give him less credit. ( sorry, I had a hard time wording this! )

Here goes to the best I know; he knows and identifies the 8 parts of speech, with extensive diagramming practice. Has had no practice taking notes, outlining( I believe will be covered in another English pace he has yet to do) or writing reports.
Reads assigned history texts on his own according to schedule, reads & follows directions. It's been a few years since he's done any oral narrations. Has written lengthy narrations- the year we did yr 5 MFW, he would write a notebook page full. I have not had him do written narrations this year as we are doing Biblioplan and they have them answering questions in the form of short answer, 1-3 sentence answers and essay questions. His written narrations depend on the amount of reading he has done. His written narrations he does in CTC science are pretty short compared to what he did last year in his history. He's had no formal literature study & no formal instruction in essay writing.

I hope this helps!

Becky

[kidsforHim]

I know Carrie is really super busy. I'm anxious to get any help with this & I don't want it to get lost so just bumping it up.

Becky

[kidsforHim]

Well, I guess we will just see what happens... Was hoping to figure this out so I could have an idea how much it would cost for budgeting reasons..the Budget seems to be having too much a say in the matter

I appreciate those who have shared their thoughts. My son was excited about all the books- 'you mean we get to read ALL THOSE BOOKS?!" He IS a book lover, especially anything history.

Becky

[Jennymommy]

Becky, Rod and Staff English 6 will cover various types of outlines, as will Essentials in Writing. However, have you considered doing Revival to Revolution with both boys as written, using the advanced science and extensions for older ds, along with DITHOR 6-7-8 for highschool worthy credit...no fiddling with plans The following year could be MTMM with extensions, including chem 101 dvds and DITHOR 6-7-8 again for highschool credit, as well as following the suggestions for beefing up the economics and government portion. The final year could be WG as written. The only adjustment I see would be foreign language. Maybe I'm missing something, and I hope someone else will chime in , but having gone through the MTMM and now WG with a slower worker, this looks like a good layout. And yes, my ds also loves the ease of use, great books, and clear planning of HOD.

[Jennymommy]

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=7765&p=56997#p5699 and viewtopic.php?f=35&t=11148 and viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8208&p=59715 and viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8226. These may be helpful if you haven't read them already:-)