New and questions

This is where new posts begin. All questions or discussions about any of Heart of Dakota's curriculums start here. If you wish to share a one-time post about your family's experience with our curriculum, you may post under the specific curriculum title (found beneath this "Main Board" heading).
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ShowersofBlessings
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 3:15 am

New and questions

Post by ShowersofBlessings » Mon Jul 21, 2014 6:59 am

Hi everyone,

I've been using Ambleside Online this past year, and really loved it. For various reasons we have to move on. I need something laid out for me and with more handholding. I will be doing 3 different guides as I can't combine my children. :shock: I'm a bit nervous starting 3 guides. Can anyone give me an idea of what a day looks like running these three guides? Any tips on what subjects t ocover first, or with whom to work first? I assume working with the little one first?

I'll be using Saxon math with my children as Singapore has not been a good fit for us. Is anyone using Saxon? How much time does it add to your day? (I'm pretty sure it adds time) :wink:

I'm thinking of using my AO books for storytime and DITHOR books. Anyone done this before? Anyone got a nice file with AO books sorted by genre? :lol: One can dream, right? I guess I'll be making one myself.

My eldest hasn't got cursive down yet. He's still practicing. How much cursive writing will be done in Preparing? He's finishing up his cursive handwriting book, but I feel he needs more practice before writing in cursive every day.

Are there any samples of the dictation passages in Preparing? and of the spelling lists in Beyond?

I guess those are my questions for now :) We're very excited to start this curriculum, and my children are mostly looking forwards to crafts and experiments.
Starting 3 Guides this September:
Preparing
Beyond
LHTH

Samuel'sMommy
Posts: 647
Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2008 1:59 pm
Location: TN
Contact:

Re: New and questions

Post by Samuel'sMommy » Mon Jul 21, 2014 2:21 pm

Hi and welcome to the boards! I'm sure you will find all the ladies here extremely helpful! I can't answer all your questions, but I'm sure others will chime in.
ShowersofBlessings wrote: I'll be using Saxon math with my children as Singapore has not been a good fit for us. Is anyone using Saxon? How much time does it add to your day? (I'm pretty sure it adds time) :wink:
I use Saxon math and yes, it will add time for your day. I think in most of the guides Carrie plans on Singapore taking anywhere from 15-30 minutes depending on the guide. We were already using Saxon when we started HOD so we have just continued with it. We are currently on using Saxon Intermediate 4 and it can take him anywhere from 30 minutes to an hour depending on the day. However, he also does not stay focused well and I have to redirect him constantly back to his math work so the lessons could possibly take less time if you have a focused child.
ShowersofBlessings wrote: I'm thinking of using my AO books for storytime and DITHOR books. Anyone done this before? Anyone got a nice file with AO books sorted by genre? :lol: One can dream, right? I guess I'll be making one myself.
I haven't used Ambleside so I'm not sure exactly what books are used. On the website where you order DITHOR you should see a place to order the HOD Book List. It is a list Carrie has done of many, many books (not just the ones in DITHOR packs) listed by level and genre. You may find many of the Ambleside books on that list.

I hope that helps a little!
Stephanie
Wife to Adam for 25 years
Mom to Samuel (18 - freshman in college), Isaiah (8), and Judah (4) through the miracle of adoption
Using and loving LHTH & BLHFHG

Loved using LHTH, LHFHG, BLHFHG, BHFHG, PHFHG, CTC, & RTR!

MelInKansas
Posts: 1700
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 7:32 pm

Re: New and questions

Post by MelInKansas » Mon Jul 21, 2014 3:19 pm

I am doing those guides, well we just finished LHTH this week so now I am doing Preparing, Beyond, and LHFHG but haven't dived into LHFHG quite yet. So I can tell you how I do it.

But when you first start, since all of you are new to HOD, you will need a few weeks to get into the guides and understand how they work. It always takes longer when you first start a guide to complete a day's worth of work than it will once you are 3-4 weeks into it. So don't be discouraged, and expect it to be harder at the beginning. Each week has a lot of the same things you are doing and as the children get used to their guides and what they will be doing it goes faster and more smoothly.

What I like to do before I start is try to lay out all the different boxes and at least an estimate of how long each one takes (not at first, but once you get into it). There is guidance for this in the individual boards for each guide, in the "Sharing your schedule" thread that is sticky at the top of this board. Think through each of your children's strengths and things they enjoy, and weaknesses or things they do not enjoy. Think about your Preparing child and how independent that child is ready to be (or will you have to train them up and get them used to the independent work for a while). Then I map out which order I will do the boxes in and therefore which child I am working with (and especially for your preschooler what they will be doing while you are working with an older child).

Here is what mine looks like. I like to take 45 minute-1 hour blocks with each child.

LHTH right after breakfast, or while the others are finishing breakfast (this takes about 30 minutes).
Preparing - I spend an hour with this child while the other 2 play or listen to audio books. I do Reading about History, Storytime, (Geography on day 2, this is usually really fast), Bible study, Poetry, and either DITHOR or English/Dictation. If time, I get her started on the History project. Then she is supposed to go do her math, independent History, and independent Science boxes on her own while I work with the Beyond child. If she is done before I am she is to practice piano or something.
Beyond - She typically will do her copywork, spelling words (except on day 4 and 5), and math if it is something she already knows how to do on her own while I am doing LHTH at the table with the 5YO. This leaves her block with me as Reading about History, Storytime, Poetry, Bible Study, Reading (she is doing Emerging Readers), and Rotating box (art, science, geography etc). If we had to leave math for this time then we finish up math, if it's day 4 we do the spelling test and the poetry drawing, if it's day 5 we do the grammar lesson.
By this time it is lunch time. I make lunch and try to check in with the Preparing child over her independent work. After lunch the Preparing child finishes up anything left to do with me.

This is ideal and often my oldest still has several things to do after lunch, either she got up late, or poked around during her independent time. When it works well like this everyone is happy. :D

A little preparation each day or week before we start is really helpful. You have to do things like copy sheets for LHTH, copy the poem for the copywork in Beyond (I found it very helpful to blow it up so it was bigger, it made it easier to copy from), make spelling word cards, write down spelling word sentences for day 3 (I modify the spelling plans and only test on day 4, on day 1 and 2 she copies the words, look, turn it over, and write the word down, on day 3 she copies sentences with the words in them but I do use almost all of the words in about 3 sentences). There are things to copy for Preparing too, at least the science lab sheet which I just made a whole bunch of copies before we started and keep them in her notebook.

I hope this helps.
Melissa
"The steadfast love of the Lord never ceases
His mercies never come to an end"

DD12 - Rev to Rev + DITHOR 6/7/8
DD10 - CTC + DITHOR 2/3
DD7 - Bigger + ERs
DS5 - LHFHG
DD2 - ABC123
2 babies in heaven

MelInKansas
Posts: 1700
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 7:32 pm

Re: New and questions

Post by MelInKansas » Mon Jul 21, 2014 3:27 pm

Have you ordered your stuff yet?

Another thing to think through is how you want to handle the 4 day/5 day difference between Preparing and the other guides. Preparing is only scheduled to be done 4 days a week and the others have 5 day weeks. During the school year, I just plug away with both because we only school 4 days a week, so this makes it easier to get Preparing done in about a year's time. So every day that's a school day, all 3 do their full day of school work, and my oldest just moves through her units more quickly. I am not at all on a Day 1=Monday Day 5=Friday sort of schedule. But right now we are schooling 5 days a week so my oldest has a flex day, either I pick a day we are busy and therefore she has no school that day (but the younger 2 do), or if we end up leaving out some things in order to get done, she finishes them up on day 5 for the other kids.
Melissa
"The steadfast love of the Lord never ceases
His mercies never come to an end"

DD12 - Rev to Rev + DITHOR 6/7/8
DD10 - CTC + DITHOR 2/3
DD7 - Bigger + ERs
DS5 - LHFHG
DD2 - ABC123
2 babies in heaven

ShowersofBlessings
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 3:15 am

Re: New and questions

Post by ShowersofBlessings » Tue Jul 22, 2014 12:36 pm

MelInKansas wrote:Have you ordered your stuff yet?

Another thing to think through is how you want to handle the 4 day/5 day difference between Preparing and the other guides. Preparing is only scheduled to be done 4 days a week and the others have 5 day weeks. During the school year, I just plug away with both because we only school 4 days a week, so this makes it easier to get Preparing done in about a year's time. So every day that's a school day, all 3 do their full day of school work, and my oldest just moves through her units more quickly. I am not at all on a Day 1=Monday Day 5=Friday sort of schedule. But right now we are schooling 5 days a week so my oldest has a flex day, either I pick a day we are busy and therefore she has no school that day (but the younger 2 do), or if we end up leaving out some things in order to get done, she finishes them up on day 5 for the other kids.
If I do want to stretch the unit out over the fifth day, how would I do that? My first thought was to keep 2 boxes each day. but I obviously can't do that, as some of those boxes need to be covered before the next day. How do others do this?

Thank yo ufor taking the time to describe your day. That's really helpful. I did see the sticky thread, but it's kind of overwhelming to look through :p
Starting 3 Guides this September:
Preparing
Beyond
LHTH

Rice
Posts: 526
Joined: Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:00 am

Re: New and questions

Post by Rice » Tue Jul 22, 2014 1:24 pm

ShowersofBlessings wrote:Hi everyone,
I've been using Ambleside Online this past year, and really loved it. For various reasons we have to move on. I need something laid out for me and with more handholding. I will be doing 3 different guides as I can't combine my children. :shock: I'm a bit nervous starting 3 guides. Can anyone give me an idea of what a day looks like running these three guides? Any tips on what subjects t ocover first, or with whom to work first? I assume working with the little one first?
We were with Ambleside for the last 5 years and made the move here this year, too, for similar reasons. Also doing 3 guides but ours will be LHFHG, Preparing and CTC with extensions. Did you have the same name on the Forum there? Mine is the same both places.

I can't help you with the scheduling, but I'll definitely be paying attention to the responses you receive(d)!
ShowersofBlessings wrote:I'm thinking of using my AO books for storytime and DITHOR books. Anyone done this before? Anyone got a nice file with AO books sorted by genre? :lol: One can dream, right? I guess I'll be making one myself.
I'll work with you on this, if you want. We could split the Free Read list by year and each tackle one at a time, then share our work. I need to figure out DITHOR books for my oldest (done AO Yr 5 but not all free reads) and my third (done AO Yr 2 so anything from there and up are fair game for him) but I'm buying Carrie's packs for my DD. It would be nice to make use of the AO library sitting on my shelves!

I can't answer any of your other questions 'cuz' I'm in the same boat!

Glad to share the journey with you!
Blessings,
Rice

DS 21 - GRAD '20: after WG
DD 19 - GRAD '21: after WH
DS 17 - GRAD '22; did CTC-WH + 2yrs non-HOD (🇨🇦)
DS 15 not using a guide this year (DONE: LHFHG-MTMM)
DS 13 MTMM (DONE: Prep-Rev2Rev)
DS 11 +
DD 9 CTC (DONE: Prep)
6yo DS phonics

MelInKansas
Posts: 1700
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 7:32 pm

Re: New and questions

Post by MelInKansas » Tue Jul 22, 2014 5:48 pm

For a little while I was doing the 4 days in 5 just to lighten the load. To make sure we did not repeat any boxes in a particular day I would leave off 2 boxes on day 1 but then do those 2 along with 6 from the next day on day 2, then finish up 4 on day 2 and 4 on day 3 the next day.... etc. She did math every day. It worked, but I think it only worked well for me because I have been doing HOD for a long time. Overall it might be a bit confusing. I would highlight the ones we were doing each day so now my guide pages have a lot of highlighter on them in the first weeks. I really enjoy doing the full day in a day when we can, and once read a tip on HOD's facebook page about trying to make sure you do that in order to get the completeness of it - they are designed to go together.

Personally I would just say make two days of 1/2 days or something or tell your child that if they work hard and diligently they can have Friday off, or just do reading and math on day 5 (the math schedule for some reason is a 5 day schedule).

Really too, I have also come to the point where it is not necessary to do Day 1-Day 5 in a week's time and it's not necessary to have all my children on the same day of the week in their guide. It works fine if you don't, though maybe I am more of a "roll with it" kind of person than some.
Melissa
"The steadfast love of the Lord never ceases
His mercies never come to an end"

DD12 - Rev to Rev + DITHOR 6/7/8
DD10 - CTC + DITHOR 2/3
DD7 - Bigger + ERs
DS5 - LHFHG
DD2 - ABC123
2 babies in heaven

Carrie
Site Admin
Posts: 8125
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 8:39 pm

Re: New and questions

Post by Carrie » Wed Jul 23, 2014 2:02 pm

Showerofblessings,

Welcome to the HOD Board. We're glad to have you here! :D

As the ladies are helping you talk through possible ideas, I wanted to pop-in and share a few things that will make your year go much better. First of all, let me begin by having you read a post I shared a little while ago about my own journey with Ambleside Online with my oldest son. The reason I share this is because it will help you better understand the suggestions I am going to make after you get done reading the post. Simply scroll down at the following link to read my post: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=15380

Now that I've spent some time qualifying my next comments, I am going to suggest that you not spend time matching Ambleside Online's books to add in as Storytime books. The reason for this suggestion is that the story time books in our guides were chosen specifically for the age and listening level of the HOD guide and chosen to add a needed element to the history study done at that time in the guide. Often the Storytime books are scheduled to add another point of view or differing perspective to a lesson. Or, they may be scheduled to bring to life a little known aspect of the time period that is needed to better understand it. Or, they may be chosen to bring forth a spiritual awareness of the time period and to bring the listener closer to the Lord, sharing ways of dealing with trials and tribulations in a God-honoring way. :D By substituting other titles in their place, you'll miss important connections that will bring your study of history to life!

One question to weigh before substituting is whether the book list from Ambleside Online is so exceptional that it needs to be substituted in place of books that were specifically chosen to fulfill a special purpose for each part of the HOD curriculum. While I do feel that some of the AO books were very good (and we do use those books along the way within our curriculum), I was less sure of the stellar qualities of some of the other books we read through AO. Keep in mind that only some of the books on the AO list were actually ones selected by Charlotte Mason. Additionally, it's good to note that Charlotte Mason did not have access to the wealth of reading material that we have available today. I do know from what I've read that Charlotte Mason spent extensive time choosing books each year for her students to read. That was where her focus always was, which means I think she might be surprised to discover that we aren't using some of the newer wonderful book selections and instead are simply continuing to pick off of her older book lists! What we schedule within HOD is a mix of the old and the new. We spend much time on the book selection process, sifting and sorting to find the very best mix. The emphasis is always on the books. If you try what we have scheduled I think you will be pleasantly surprised. :D

Secondly, through my years with AO, I found that the book selections were consistently very difficult requiring much time to process. While that was fine when doing only a few books each year as AO had scheduled, by the time we add in the volume and richness of the HOD program; to add an AO book on top of it would be expecting way too much. To do that would be replacing a book that was meant to function in one way with a book that was meant to function a different way in a different curriculum. You will discover as you do HOD (and probably did discover as you did AO) that both of our guides are so much more than just a book list. They are a philosophy or a way of learning. While within AO, each book has a specific place and a specific purpose, the same is true within HOD. This means that the less substituting you do, the more the program will function the way it was designed. This makes for less stress and more enjoyment all the way around. :D

While you could use some of the free reads from AO with DITHR, I wouldn't be very quick to plug too many of those titles into DITHR either. The books on the free reading list for AO are very advanced and often are scheduled way too young, in my opinion. Yes, the child may be able to read a book like that at the age suggested, but how much richer would his/her experience be with the book if he waited until he was a bit older? Also, keep in mind that with DITHR we are having the child really think critically about the story and draw out connections and themes. This is not easy to do and if on top of that a really difficult book is added to read at the same time, the lessons will become too hard too fast. When using DITHR at first, it is better to err on the side of the book being too easy, rather than too hard, simply because of the extra mental work required to complete the DITHR exercises! :wink:

Some of the AO books are wonderful, and as such we have included them within our DITHR packs already. But others on the AO list have issues, which we discovered as my older son was reading them. I found that simply being on the AO list did not guarantee that a book was great or that it could be handed to my child without needing pre-reading! While you may potentially have some issues with our books as well, we make every effort within our guides to warn you of those upcoming issues, leaving you with less pre-reading to do. I think you will also find that the balance of books within our DITHR packs help your year with DITHR flow better, as the books are chosen to create an ebb and flow as to difficulty, length, and content throughout the year. :D

So, I would encourage you that if you have decided to do HOD, to do HOD. Try your best to stick with the suggestions and the scheduling we make. Make good use of your AO books for free-reading or family read aloud time, but don't spend tons of time trying to plug them into an HOD guide. :D

As far as teaching the guide goes, I would highly recommend sticking with the plans as close to the way they are written as possible. Routinely shifting boxes to other days or making a schedule that takes the plans apart will quickly result in losing both the flow and the ease of use of the guide. When we talk to families who have left HOD and then returned, they always share that they did too much substituting and too much moving of boxes and randomly moving through the guide. This seems to be a pitfall for those who aren't successful with HOD. When families return, they often share with us their goal to stick much closer to the plans. So, I suggest trying hard to complete a day of plans within a day. If you do have to slow down, split one day of plans over two days as needed. I've had to do this for seasons myself! But try not to move boxes from various parts of the plans to an extra day at the end. Each day is specifically written to make connections among the boxes of plans on that day. Moving boxes means the connections fall apart and the plans begin to feel random and fall apart too. :wink:

You can do 3 guides, as we have done 4 at our house for years. But, I have to honestly say I couldn't have done 4 guides if I had done many of the things being pondered in this thread. This is because adding and substituting resources takes time to plan, which often results in precious teaching time lost. It also means that no one can just open their guide and go for the day (including you). Moving boxes to different days takes time to plan and manage, and again now no one can just open their guide and know what to do today. It also makes the program feel random as the connections are lost. Adding a time intensive math program for multiple students will really add time to your day. With this in mind, I would look carefully to see if any of your kiddos could benefit from Singapore math. It is easier to start a child in Singapore math when they are younger. Perhaps, you could do Singapore with your younger kiddos and just do Saxon with your older child or children. These are all things to consider, to keep your day manageable and your teaching time in line. :D

Of course, you may feel differently and as the teacher you will need to make your own decisions. We do have many families who are successful with HOD who use a different math program or a different grammar program. We do have families select their own books for DITHR and thrive with the program. You'll just need to bear in mind how much time each of these changes are adding to your day or whether the substitutions are making your day go very long. I pray these thoughts will be of use to you as you ponder what is best for your family. I've learned the things I am sharing with you the hard way, in the trenches from years in the classroom and years schooling my own kiddos with HOD. I just want you to have every opportunity to enjoy HOD with your kiddos and not get overwhelmed. :D

Blessings,
Carrie

ShowersofBlessings
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 3:15 am

Re: New and questions

Post by ShowersofBlessings » Fri Aug 01, 2014 1:06 pm

Wow, Carrie! Thank you so much for taking the time to reply. I let my husband read your reply as well and we both at peace with leaving the AO books for what they are for now. There's always summertime ;)

I will try really hard not to add anything, but ds1 is gifted and has both his Greek and French. Also we'll be beefing up the science for him. Not because I don't think it's enough, but because he wants more. This will obviously be the first to go if I find out it's too much. So yes, I want to stick with the guide, yet do I need to challenge my son. I'm thinking of adding these extra subjects on the 5th day.

What kind of supplies would I need for these 3 guides? I'm thinking notebooks, craft materials etc.?
Starting 3 Guides this September:
Preparing
Beyond
LHTH

MelInKansas
Posts: 1700
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 7:32 pm

Re: New and questions

Post by MelInKansas » Fri Aug 01, 2014 3:13 pm

The best thing to do is get your books and then read through the introduction to each guide (I am in process of doing this right now) for ideas on what supplies and notebooks you may need. Generally for Bigger, Preparing, maybe CTC it is one notebook per student (1 1/2 inch), with dividers, and page protectors to put copywork or science lab sheets into (though some people might use separate spiral notebooks for subjects, but you often need unlined paper so I like the loose leaf notebook where you can either have the lined or unlined paper as need be, plus less paper waste). We have used one notebook to contain all work for LHFHG and Beyond because there just isn't as much written work in those two guides. Wide ruled notebook paper. Pencils, colored pencils, a good pencil sharpener, construction paper, magazines, glue, scissors, paint, paintbrushes, (crayons in younger guides) are general needs you probably could already figure out and places to organize all these things. Most other supplies are things you probably have on hand or can substitute easily - salt, aluminum foil, wax paper, flour, food coloring, etc etc.
Melissa
"The steadfast love of the Lord never ceases
His mercies never come to an end"

DD12 - Rev to Rev + DITHOR 6/7/8
DD10 - CTC + DITHOR 2/3
DD7 - Bigger + ERs
DS5 - LHFHG
DD2 - ABC123
2 babies in heaven

ShowersofBlessings
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 3:15 am

Re: New and questions

Post by ShowersofBlessings » Fri Aug 01, 2014 3:47 pm

Thanks :D I will be able to order my guides and books in 2 weeks time. Can't wait!
Starting 3 Guides this September:
Preparing
Beyond
LHTH

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