Singapore Math 6A/6B necessary?

[3sweeties]

Hi everyone!

Just wondering if there are those of you out there who went on to Singapore 6A/6B after completing 5B and if you think it is necessary? Is it Pre-Algebra or Pre-pre Algebra? Does it take more time for me to teach compared to 5B? Is there a HIG? Is it hard for a non-mathy person like me to teach?

My DS is about to finish up 5B and will be in 7th grade next year. He may be leaning towards an architechture/engineering/math type of career (he is naturally gifted at drawing, very logical thinker, etc.), so does that mean he should hit Algebra in 8th grade? I didn't do Algebra until 9th and was really BAD at it, so this point in math is scary and confusing for me! Anyway, I mostly just wanted to see what those of you who have successfully used Singapore all the way through thought and get your input!

Thank you!

[StephanieU]

Algebra 1 in 9th grade is okay for science/math majors. The key is being ready to take Calculus 1 in college. I wouldn't push too fast, as normally that causes gaps in math education. And those gaps can cause huge problems later. For example, may students struggle in Calculus not because of the Calculus formulas but because of gaps in their algebra skills. Many families can go from 6A/6B to Algebra, but I don't think going from 5B to Algebra would be possible.

I haven't used those levels yet, but I don't think there is a jump in teacher time between 5 and 6. I think the 7 and up have a different feel from what I have read, but not 6.

[3sweeties]

Okay, thanks!

So it sounds like 6A/6B is Pre-Algebra since you go usually into Algebra from there? I have noticed a push in my homeschooling group/world and even in the STEM programs in the public schools now to do Algebra in 8th grade. I am all for waiting until 9th for Algebra if it will help him have a solid foundation. Just also didn't want it to count against him once he is a junior or senior, you know? Just now figuring out the "ready for highschool" thing! It seemed sooooo far away just a few short years ago in K when we started homeschooling...can't believe it's around the corner!!!!

[MomtoJGJE]

Since he's homeschooled it probably doesn't matter since you can tailor his education around what he wants to do later on top of giving him a good well-rounded foundation.

However, I'm not sure that any child who is headed to college in a math related field would take algebra after 8th grade. I know when I was in school (and I'm 36 this year) the college bound kids all took algebra in 8th grade.

So, with that said, I would probably look at not skipping anything but I would likely get whichever math curriculum it is (I can't remember right now) that has Algebra I, II, and Geometry all together. I think... maybe it's just Algebra 1&2. That would get him on track.

[mamanlait]

For us, Singapore 6 has been well worth our time. It firmed up all that dd had learned plus dug deeper. I noticed that toward the middle of 6B, dd stopped making those silly mistakes that had worried me throughout Singapore. She got to the point of rarely needing help from the HIG or me for most of the (quite difficult) word problems. Singapore 6B has been wonderful. I have seen the amalgamation of all the concepts that she has learned in math over all of these years with Singapore.

I do use the HIG but, at times, just show her the worked solutions directly out of the HIG rather than work them for her myself on the white board. This has been especially helpful when there is a complex drawing that might take me extra time to write out. I would not worry AT ALL about doing Singapore 6 in 8th grade even, but for 7th grade...definitely use it! It is far more difficult than any Pre-Algebra text I've reviewed which is the standard for PS in my state for 8th grade. We have about 1/4 of 6B left to finish in 8th here then we will move on to Foerster's SLOWLY. I have no plans to speed through Singapore or Foerster's. I've heard over and over again that a strong foundation is key to success in the upper high school levels of math. My plan is to successfully have dd finish out Pre-Calc prior to graduation. I do not think this will stymie her ability to go into any science/math/engineering area if she desires that. Instead, it should be a slow and steady progress to prepare her! If she does show an interest in completing Calc during HS, we can double up on Geometry and Alg 2 if need-be (that happens to be what I did in HS).

[StephanieU]

There are many college bound kids that don't take Calculus in high school. My husband and his brother didn't, and they both have bachelors degrees in Engineering. My husband started college with College Algebra, and his brother started with Intermediate Algebra. Starting that low wasn't ideal (both will agree with that), but both were able to graduate in 4-4.3 years (BIL had to take 1 class over the summer after he walked). And this was at an engineering school, and they had no problems getting accepted. But, if both of them (and their mom) could do it again, they would strive to be ready for Calculus as a freshman. That way the courses line up. Even students who take Calculus in high school often start college with Cal 1 (and some don't even start there because they bomb the placement test and have to start lower). Definitely don't skip 6A/6B. If you only get through Pre Cal in high school, then don't worry. As long as he is strong in the algebra, the calculus won't be hard.
(I teach math at a community college, and I have taught Calculus before...)

[mamanlait]

StephanieU,
I appreciate that confirmation from a math professional! I need all of the encouragement I can get.

[pjdobro]

I probably have a different viewpoint than others. For us Singapore 6 seemed like a lot of review without a lot of new thrown in, but I wouldn't say it was a waste of time. I think it helped solidify some good problem solving techniques and introduced a few new concepts. It didn't seem like we were covering that much new material though just exploring more problem solving techniques and solidifying our skills. In retrospect I think my high performing math students could have by-passed Singapore 6 and moved directly into prealgebra. Though Singapore 6 does cover some prealgebra concepts, it isn't prealgebra per se and there are a few concepts like exponents, negative numbers, and square roots that it doesn't focus on much if any that a typical prealgebra program would cover. I'm not for sure though if it would be comfortable for a student to go from Singapore 5 to algebra. I haven't done that and it probably isn't usually recommended. I'm not for sure how my dc would have done making that leap. We didn't find that Singapore 6 took any more time really than 5. The one thing I loved about Singapore is how to the point it is and how little time it took. We didn't have the same experience with the Singapore Discovering Mathematics 7.

It's true that it seems that algebra 1 is covered more typically in 8th grade or earlier these days. In my day, it wasn't offered until high school, at least where I was. I felt like this put me at a disadvantage when I entered college because so many of my fellow engineering students had already had Calculus 1 in high school. In the long run though it wasn't a problem at all. Though they started in Calculus 2 or 3 and I started in Calculus 1, we all ended in the same place. I think the advice you have already received is very good. Make sure that your dc has a solid foundation in the basics. That will help more in the long run than trying to rush through things and get to the finish line faster.

I think if I understood your post, your ds will be in 7th next year and ready to do Singapore 6A/B. I think in your shoes, I would continue that path with him and then have him do Foerster's Algebra in 8th. That will put him on target to get to Calculus by the end of high school and that will be a real solid foundation for whatever STEM type career he chooses.

[3sweeties]

Thank you SO MUCH, everyone!

So it sounds like we should just go ahead and continue on with Singapore 6A/6B for 7th and then do Forester's (or one of the other recommended algebras) for 8th? It sounds like those of you who did Singapore through 6B didn't have issues moving into Algebra after that? Is that right?

[pjdobro]

We didn't go directly from 6B to algebra exactly but only because of the age of my dc. We did go to a pre-algebra class, but in comparing our pre-algebra class to the algebra classes, it was more algebra than pre-algebra and my dc did very well. Singapore prepared them well. I don't think your ds will have a problem at all going from Singapore 6B to a program like Foersters algebra. Like I mentioned before the only thing that Singapore didn't spend a lot of time on that pre-algebra courses do is negative numbers, exponents, and square roots. Those things will still be reviewed before used that much in the algebra course. Here is a quote from Carrie on her recommendation for students who have followed the Singapore path:

Great question! I'm so sorry to be confusing. Yes, generally students who have excelled in Singapore 6A/6B should be able to go straight into Foerster Algebra I. Students who have struggled in Singapore 6A/6B will need some more formal pre-algebra first, before going into something like Foerster, which they could do through DM 7A/7B if desired (or through another route if Singapore was tough for them).

DM 1A/1B and Foerster overlap in many places, so DM 7A/7B would overlap some too. However, the progression of skills and overall depth of content of Foerster is greater than DM 1A/1B (now 7A/7B) so that it still made sense for my son to do Foerster for a thorough treatment of Algebra I. Students would have to complete multiple levels of DM to hit everything in Foerster.

Blessings,
Carrie

It sounds like your son will be ready to move onto to Foesters after completing 6A/6B this year.

[my3sons]

I agree! I'd do 6A/6B and use the HIG's for help as needed. It was well worth the time we spent in it, and it prepared Wyatt well for Foerster's Algebra 1. HTH!

In Christ,
Julie