Beyond, and "Indians" (First Nations / Native Peoples)

[gardenmama28]

Hi there,

We've had a great year so far with LHFHG and are looking forward to Beyond for the fall. One concern I have is with the wording in the History readers....... In Canada, is is pretty much seen as a swear word or a racial slur to call a First Nations / Native person an Indian. I have a hard time with all the references to the "Indians", yet I know that is what people called them in that time period...... Any suggestions / experience with how to approach this issue as you teach through Beyond?

[Gwenny]

That is so interesting. I didn't know that. I've never heard First Nations. This will probably be the first of many things like that you will run into and can just discuss. Just wait until the different books/writings on all of the horrible things they called black people. I think it's very simple, that's what they use to say or call them. Sometimes people use mean names for others and it's not good. That said, I don't think it's mean/ugly to say Indian. But maybe some of them do? I typically hear Native American now. I have a daughter that is an Apache Indian. It's pretty awkward sometimes as we read about some of the things they did, some of the ways they treated people, and some of the ways they were badly treated. She is my little Indian girl-our term of endearment.
I'm curious what Candians call black people. Most here are saying African American. I don't agree with it. Do they say African Canadian? . I have 3 black children. 2 of them are from Africa. They are true African Americans because they are American citizens now but are from Africa, or they can be just called Americans. I have one born in the U.S. He is not an African American. He is an American. I call myself white, and they are black. Nothing bad about that. It's so interesting how we can get so sensitive to things.

Anyway.....chalk it up in Beyond next year to another learning experience about fallible humans and how things change over the years.
Blessings.

[gardenmama28]

It is interesting how things can change through the years isn't it? But yes, in Canada, only a Native person could use the word "Indian" (usually while joking with their friends), and not be seen as racist / ignorant. Another similar one, is that many people say, "Eskimo" when that people group prefers to be referred to as "Inuit". Most First Nations people I know are very comfortable with the term, "Native". I As far as what black people are called...... there are very few in our area so I am not too sure but I can tell you it would be something politically correct as Canadians pride themselves on political correctness! I would think people just say, "black".

Also in Canada there are many immigrants, and an Indian person would be..... from India!

I grew up in an area that was populated by probably half Native people so maybe I am more sensitive to this issue than others..... It is easier to sub in different words in a textbook format than in a story, and I know that the colonists would not have said, "the Native Americans are coming!" Maybe I'll just have to have to try subbing in words in some cases, and talking it through with the kids in other areas......

[Nealewill]

I do think it may be ackward but the Pilgrims probably did just call them Indians. I would tell your children that you don't call them that and that it is no okay to use that term freely. But you could tell your kids that they were truly called Indians. Just a thought. You can always substitute what every call them now with what is written in the book. For us, as we move ahead in guides and as we have learned about that past, I have actually told my kids the negative terms that people have called blacks and my kids actually do know all words. Honestly, I told them. And yes my kids are young. But I think it is important they know not to use them. I would hate for them to learn them and then use them not knowing. That is just me though.

[Daisy]

Can you just explain the origin of the term (the assumption at first that Columbus had landed in Asia) and how the term has changed in meaning (become derogatory in your country) over time? Then you can tell them that because we don't use that word any longer, you are going to substitute "First Nation" or "Native people" whenever we see that word. I think that way your child understands that the Pilgrims were not intending to offend, but also doesn't have them hearing a word over and over and over again that is offensive in your culture.

By the way, I live in CA and we don't use the term Indian much anymore either. Perhaps because we have a large Sikh community here.

[lucsch]

The word "indian," usually "American Indian," is still acceptable in the U. S., though "Native American" is used, as well. This is a difference between Canada and the U. S. I would explain it in that way. I really think all of this P. C. is crazy. I live in Indiana, and I would hope we aren't made to change the name of our state!

[Gwenny]

I wouldn't be surprised if Indiana gets changed. My husband and I went to the Univ. of IL and we miss Chief Illiniwek!

[mothermayi?]

I am 50% Choctaw, 25% Black, 25% White. I'm not speaking for all of my people, as this is only my personal preference and opinion. I prefer my Choctaw heritage be called "Native"...not Native American because we were here before any Pilgrims set foot on stage. We were here before the label "America" was even thought of. We are not Indians because we are not from India. We are from *this* land...later to be called America. I don't get offended when some refers to us as Native American, as I know they are trying to be politically correct and they don't mean any harm.

As for being Black, this part of my heritage is from Guinea, Africa...the land my 5th great grandmother was stolen from while still in her mother's womb. She was from Africa but I am not. I am simply an American, considering I was born here. Again, I don't get upset when people say African American because typically their hearts are in the right place and it doesn't come from ill-intent. I suppose we should call white people by their origin?? Irish American? Italian American? Swedish American? African American would fit in terms of this labeling and it is simply ridiculous. Are we not all just Americans? I don't see why we have to set apart Black Americans...well, actually I do know why but I won't go there.

Again, this is just my opinion which has been formed through life experiences as being a woman of color living in America, as well as being married to a Black man and having multi-racial children who are assumed African American because they have one drop of Black blood.

One last thought, we have to keep in mind who is coining these "Politically Correct" terms. It is not the leaders of these different ethnic groups. White man decides what others should be called. I believe the politically correct terms would be vastly different if tribal and group leaders had input .

[my3sons]

Thank you for sharing everyone! We live in SD, and we have a rich heritage of history where one can visit the Black Hills and see Crazy Horse or watch tribal dances or eat Indian food. The first school I taught in prior to homeschooling had many different groups of people represented, but the students I had referred to themselves as "Indians," as did their parents, so we followed suit. We bought our current home 6 years ago from a lovely couple, and the wife told me she was 30% Indian and that was why they were moving to build on Indian ground near the Indian reservation (her words). Her granddaughter babysat for us, and when I told her I wished I tanned as easily as her and had her pretty skin, she laughed and told me she was 25% Indian and if I just had a little Indian in me I might not be so sunburned all of the time! So this is how it is where I live, at least.

Having traveled some now, I have realized that "Native Americans" is preferred in other areas of the nation, so I have tried to say that, but even that may be wrong in some areas. I long to say it right!!! But sometimes, I just try not to say it at all, as I would never want to offend anyone and am worried I might accidentally. When reading Beyond's books, I read what they say and we discuss as we go. When we have read about difficult things in history, whether it be slavery or the Trail of Tears, or the Holocaust, I have made sure to use the historically accurate words as they are written, so that my dc understand that part of history when they are reading about it in other resources later (as they read nonfiction, historical fiction, biographies, and realistic fiction about history topics as well independently without my constant supervision, and they would more than likely come across these words at some point anyway as they are a real part of our history). I want them to know these words and realize why they may no longer be used. But, I have stressed that how we speak about people, the names we give to people groups, and the way we address each other is very important to consider! Unknowingly, we can offend someone or hurt their feelings, and that's why it is so important to weigh what we say in light of how that person or group may feel when we say it.

I have also told the boys how sad I am that these things are a part of our history, and that if sin was not in the world, what a wonderful place it would be, and how differently our history would read! I also have suggested that before using a name for a group, they should listen to how the people themselves 'name' themselves and try to follow suit. However, even this is not always accurate, as people group's can refer to themselves within their group one way, and find it offensive when someone not in their people group refers to them in the same way. So, obviously discussions about this are excellent and important to have! I have also told the boys that it is 'to one's glory to overlook an offense' (Proverbs 19:11) in regard to comments about them they may not like (sometimes this is in regard to homeschooling, sometimes in regard to other things). However, just coming away with the understanding that this is a sensitive topic that requires real thought, care, and attention has been an important lesson I'm glad they have learned and are learning.

In Christ,
Julie

[StephanieU]

You could also start off the year with some fun "vocabulary" to help explain that words carry different meaning based on where you live, the time period, etc. For example, in the US we use the word pants for trousers. In England, pants are underwear (and they use trousers for long pants). So, to say pants here is normal but to say it there is almost saying something indecent. The word gay is another fun example that has new meaning today then it did a century ago. Maybe a discussion on words like this will help your kids understand why some times it is okay to say Indian and other times it is not.

[TrueGRIT]

Interesting topic. Love seeing what others say. Where I come from though "Indian" is the preferred term, mainly because it is easiest. I, myself, am part Cherokee & Choctaw. I consider myself part Indian, though I know that is not quite accurate.

For you, I believe StephanieU 's post had good merit. Children do need to be taught other words, and learn they are not "correct" etc. My oldest has been well informed of many of these - and taught what to say, and not say.
Julie gave great advice, as always. Hope you figure out what to do soon. Enjoy your year with Beyond!

[gardenmama28]

Thanks everyone for your thoughts and input! It helps me to just think through how to approach this for the coming year. Definitely some discussions are in order, both about culture and how it varies from place to place, and also how language is something that can change over time.

Thanks too for those of you of Native Ancestry who commented - it makes me feel better about using these resources when I know that in American culture it is not offensive to use the term "Indian." - it helps me to have a different mindset when reading through these books.

[TracyP]

Hi gardenmama28, Since you are concerned about the use of the word Indians, I wanted to give you a further heads up about Beyond. Weeks 17-20 may also be problematic. In these weeks Natives kidnap two little boys, demand alcohol, shoot at two children hiding in kettles, and were about to kidnap children on two other occasions but the kids "saved the day" and avoided being taken. My husband has Native American heritage, and we live just outside a reservation. I couldn't stomach giving my kids this one-sided impression of Native people.

Mothermayi, I am curious about how you handled this. Am I being too sensitive?

[Mumkins]

I'm Canadian too. I just filled out some government forms and had to bring in ID and part of the acceptable ID was "Indian status card". So, I'm guessing that's still the official term. Though I do hear 'Native American' quite a bit and 'first nations'. They still have 'Indian Villages' around here to visit. For me, it's not a big deal. I've explained why they were called Indians and that we now call them Native Americans. Just like Eskimo/Inuit.

Whicg province do you live in?

[MomtoJGJE]

Hi gardenmama28, Since you are concerned about the use of the word Indians, I wanted to give you a further heads up about Beyond. Weeks 17-20 may also be problematic. In these weeks Natives kidnap two little boys, demand alcohol, shoot at two children hiding in kettles, and were about to kidnap children on two other occasions but the kids "saved the day" and avoided being taken. My husband has Native American heritage, and we live just outside a reservation. I couldn't stomach giving my kids this one-sided impression of Native people.

Mothermayi, I am curious about how you handled this. Am I being too sensitive?

This is not one sided because overall Beyond paints a very true picture. We tend to shy away from the bad things some natives (in all places I would imagine, but mainly America) did because what the white people did was overall worse. But that doesn't stop the fact that some people did bad things. These stories aren't necessarily painting a picture in our children's minds about Indians/white people.... they are overall painting a picture of kids doing the right thing against adults who are not.

Did you read the story about the British commander coming into the house, ransacking it to find the key, and then the little girl saving the day? Did you read the story about the boy and girl not hiding the silver and standing up to the British officers?

Beyond is all about choosing the right thing, no matter who is on the other side.