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For those of you doing, or have done, DITHR and Bigger Hearts:

My 8 YO is doing these programs and I would say all along through HOD she has struggled with grasping the concepts we are learning in some of the character traits. In the Bible box we talk about a character quality each week. While she can have a reasonable discussion about the trait after we define it (and we redefine it almost every day), she doesn't really remember the meanings of the words. And most often the discussion questions - like "how can you display this trait?" - she can't really answer. She always goes back to (which is something we are always talking about) "I should obey my parents" or "I should be nice." I am wondering if I should add that onto vocabulary when there's vocabulary in the rotating box, or one of the days of the Bible box or something. I think looking it up and writing it down would help her remember, perhaps. But then I kind of wonder if these concepts aren't just a bit too abstract for her still. Has anyone else's DC struggled with this? I would love to hear how others have struggled or grown through this study.

Maybe rather than asking "how can you show kindness?" You could give her a situation "okay, you're in the library and there is a mom checking out with a stack of books and her 2 year old is trying to run off... how could you show kindness?" She might answer something like, "well... I guess I could run after the child and then play with him near his mom until her books are ready..."

Maybe? It might be easier for her to answer a hypothetical question like that.

Yes, that's a good idea and I do do this. I ask more "leading" questions or try to come up with an example. But I am asking the questions as they are written in the guide (or DITHR). For example, today in DITHR we did "brotherly kindness" and "compassion." Long words, she doesn't really understand. So we had definitions and a Bible verse to read about each trait and then some discussion based on the DITHR reading, which today the reading (Chapter 4 in Catwings) actually had a character that demonstrated brotherly love VERY well I would say. Sometimes of course the examples don't line up quite that well with the literature reading.

Here were the questions: Day 14 of Fantasy in DITHR
How do the characters show love? Or compassion? (she did pretty well on this one)
Did the characters show the opposite traits of hatred or indifference? Explain? (she didn't really understand the question, I had to lead her to some kind of answer)
What could the characters do differently to be more loving or compassionate? (very generic answer but I was struggling a bit myself as the characters had been loving and compassionate so I let her get by with it)

Maybe the real problem is that I myself sometimes struggle with answering some of the questions. So maybe I "change" them a little bit so they make sense to me. But the thing that I am wondering if she is normal in this or if we need to focus a bit more on understanding these qualities, at least the definitions of them, is that she really can't answer about the qualities themselves, it seems like some of the ideas are too abstract. We had "Loyalty" as our Storytime reading activity today too and she has always struggled with understanding Loyalty. In addition to the Storytime reading I talked about the story of Peter denying Jesus and asked her "was that showing Loyalty?" She knew "no" (though I suppose yes and no answers aren't the best for seeing whether they understand). But I hope bringing in that example might have helped her understand more what Loyalty means.

No advice, but we have struggled with this, too. My oldest dd (just finished Preparing) still has a really hard time coming up with those answers for DITHOR...I guess I thought it was because I haven't been extrememly consistent with these types of questions . She missed out on a big chunk of Bigger because I was correcting a poor placement decision, and for some reason DITHOR is still really hard for us to get to every day. We're looking at Bigger next school year for the next kiddo in line, so I don't know if it will come any easier for him, or not.

So, I don't really know why I commented on this, except to let you know that imho I think they are just difficult and abstract concepts for kids to grasp and apply sometimes.

I think that might be one of those things that takes maturity for it to click. Exposure now that gives them something to build on later.

I know that my oldest didn't get it until just the past few months, right around the time she turned 10. Just like you, I was giving leading questions, discussing things, examples, etc..... She was giving blank stares.

I know that if I just ask the questions in the guide, my 8yo doesn't get it either. Once I give explanations and examples, she can make good sentences but to actually think of it on her own just isn't happening.

I really really struggle to come up with "deeper meaning" things out of readings. Like it would take me a while to come up with examples of brotherly love or hatred from the books. And sometimes I can't. At all. I just don't read that way. SO maybe some of it is that, too? I never had the exposure to read like that though.... and I can really see it playing out with my oldest. She's starting to be able to think her way through reading.

I am not doing an HOD guide currently, which I explained in another thread. But, I remember while doing Beyond & Bigger, we would run into the same thing. First, I agree with Lora Beth. This is exposure, and as the child matures, he/she will learn how to display the character in their personal life. When an opportunity to display this character presents itself, point out to your child that here is a way you can show........, just like so and so did in a certain story. Also, depending on the book you read, it may be hard to answer questions like, 'what could the characters have done differently to..........?' I found a few times that I could not answer the question because I felt things were handled well. So, I would just point out to my daughter that things were handled well. Sometimes I may think of something and would say, 'maybe they could have done........, but I think they handled it pretty well'. I would not worry about the vague answers. Just keep pointing out opportunities for the child to display the character. Doing it will help them internalize. It will come.

This is an interesting discussion. I know the godly character traits in Bigger and DITHOR have been some of my favorite things to cover with my dc. I agree maturity and age can make a big difference in their level of understanding but continual exposure to these ideas and good discussions get them to start thinking more deeply and aid in their understanding as they get older. As the years go on and you continue down this path, you'll find that their level of understanding deepens. I'm amazed now at the level of thinking of my dc in many instances, and I think it stems from introducing these questions and discussing them along the way. I think it is difficult as teachers to not have the answer and maybe not even see the thought process we need to get to the answer at times, but by asking the questions and exploring the answers together with our dc, we open up their minds to deeper thinking. Often times there is no right answer and the point of the lesson is the discussion. I know especially in level 2/3 of DITHOR I got the blank stares and my dc were unable to find or make connections. So we worked on it together and sometimes we came up blank and sometimes we found a connection. Whether we found one or not though I don't think mattered as much as the fact that we took the time to look at it and discuss it. Through that thought process, they have learned to look for these character traits and make connections. They have learned to read with discernment and weigh out the motives of the characters/author. Hang in there and continue to ask the questions and have those discussions relating your own experiences along the way. In time, your dc will get it.

Patty, I found your answer really helpful, not only in the Character trait discussions that we've had on this thread, but also in regards to some of the other struggles I've been having with my dd in making connections with Bible readings that we do (how they relate to the history lesson box, or in the Bible box itself). Gives me courage to know that it's okay that she's not getting these deeper meanings right now, we can just discuss it-even if I feel like I have to tell her the answers too often- and gradually she will catch on and learn to think in these ways about Scripture, as well.

Just wanted to let you know I sent you a message (OP) on some things we have done with our daughter who had some of the same issues. I wasn't sure if it was o.k. to post it here since it includes some things we've added (made by a friend for HOD).

Melissa,

The ladies have done a wonderful job of discussing your questions with you and of sharing their own experiences that are so helpful! I'm so thankful for this board and the wisdom of those who post here!

One thing that is really helpful to know is that learning to think beneath the surface of what was read and learning to make connections among various strands of learning are definitely higher level skills. Often these types of skills are not really fostered in many educational settings, simply because they do require discussion and time for the learner to sit with a reading and dwell upon it and ponder. These skills don't come naturally, as it is just so much easier to stay at the basic comprehension level in our thinking, because it just takes much less effort and is so much easier to do!

The reason we focus on this type of open-ended questioning and seeking or questing for deeper answers is because this is what God desires for us to do in His Word. He wishes us to know Him better through dwelling upon what he has shared with us both literally and beneath the surface in the Bible. He wants us to weigh everything else that we read and hear with what it says in His Word. This is to be our measuring stick for how we live our life. So, we start to foster this type of thinking from an early age, as we teach kiddos that looking beneath the surface of what you read is part of reading. We pose questions that take time to think about and discuss and we do it regularly. We want to provide as many opportunities for this type of thinking, pondering, and connecting as possible. This way kiddos have many opportunities to think about what is really being said in writing and to watch for the messages that are hidden in what they read. It is our ultimate goal for kiddos to read with moral discernment and to weigh everything they read and hear with God's Word in mind.

As you can imagine, this is a lifelong pursuit! It is not something that happens in a year or even in a few years. It is something that as adults we are still pursuing and seeking to do daily. So, if you can think of these types of questioning moments as opportunities for conversation, or opportunities to share you own thought process or examples, you will have a much more fulfilling time with your child. Think of it as a time to train your child to think deeply and Biblically one step at a time.

One thing I would caution you against would be in making the activity into a comprehension type exercise that seeks one right answer from your child. It is so tempting to do this, as this is often where our comfort level as a teacher lies (in that comprehension level, one-right-answer questions are so much easier to measure or grade)! But, if you do that you'll miss the opportunity for the deeper discussions! So, I encourage you to persevere and seize the moments to share your own thinking and examples with your child. Make it personal and your child will eventually share personally too. The deeper questions will provide dialoguing opportunities and a window into your child's mind for years to come! As your children mature, you will be so thankful for this window into their soul. I know I have been!

Blessings,
Carrie

Carrie, thank you so much for adding to this. It is very helpful for me to know the intention or purpose of the questions and what is the goal of that time being spent. I do sometimes share my own thoughts and some clues to how I got there with them. I am encouraged when my daughter does have these kind of thoughts too and have seen some growth in these areas. But sometimes it seems she doesn't get it or isn't able to. So what do you do when the question is met with a blank stare and an "I don't know?" Do you give the child a little more time and gently prod, like "well what do you think it means, or how do you think they did?" This is something I commonly do and sometimes it helps. I think she uses "I don't know" to elicit my help sometimes, then when it's clear I'm not going to give her the answer she shares something.

But it seems in terms of the definitions or understanding of what these character qualities are she just really is not getting it yet. So then it's difficult to have a discussion with her about the character quality when it seems pretty clear to me she doesn't even know what it means. If the child gives a totally off-base answer for example, then what do you recommend? I think this is partly where I have been either sharing my own thoughts, or asking leading questions sometimes. I am at least trying to determine if she even understands the question.

Again, thanks!

When I am trying to help my son understand abstract character traits, (honestly - it's for Scouts, not HOD, which we are starting this school year) - I point out to him when he does it. Yes, sometimes I have to look.. but I'm raising pretty good guys, and they give me something to work with every day.

So, "I really liked the way you showed brotherly love when your friend fell down and you ran over to check on him." "I really liked the way you showed compassion when you wanted to give your money to the Santa for the Salvation Army." etc..

In MY experience, knowing what they are feeling when they show loyalty, trustworthiness, reverence... helps them to turn the abstract idea into the concrete (for them) feeling.

That's a GREAT idea! I will try to keep an eye out and point it out when she does something with one of the character traits. I should make a list of the ones we've already covered, because there are so many and we've kind of breezed through them quickly I think. I have a confession to make I just a few weeks ago realized that the Bible box in Bigger has more in it than just reviewing the memory verse each week and talking about its meaning. The discussion questions in the Bible box are really wonderful! Today we had another good question about Loyalty because of the Bible box and once again... la la la.... we talked about the meaning of it. What it is, what it is not. Loyalty is a hard one to understand. The questions in the box helped though, it was talking about if someone else wants you to do something that you know God does not want you to do, what should you do? What about Mom and Dad? I even threw in a little bit that this is the reason God gave you Mom and Dad so we can TRY (though we are not perfect either) to demonstrate and tell them what God wants them to do. But that she must also learn it for herself and decide herself whether she will follow Christ. Such a good discussion, because I feel like she really was thinking also and she was contributing to the conversation. This time incidentally we were sitting on my bed reading and discussing because the two littlest were watching TV and I felt like the noise of it was distracting so the school kiddo came in my room with me. That I think was actually very effective. Anyway, thanks again for your thoughts.

Love the discussion and insights here-thank you, everyone! Some good food for thought. I like seeing how this is training them to read God's Word, as well as the suggestion to watch for times they are displaying the characteristics. Thanks!