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Carrie,

My 16 yo is almost done with the ACE Biology course that your recommended and we're now pulling together resources for Chemistry for his Junior year. He's told me many times this year what an interesting study it has been for him! Would you be willing to share some of the material that you've seen in this area that you feel is worthy of our consideration? I believe I remember you sharing that your son was using the Chemistry 101 DVD's as part of his curricula. Anything else?

I'll also add that my son has not used any of the science resources that are listed in the MTMM guide. If you believe any of these would have merit for a high-school Chemistry course I would be very interested.

I popped back in to post the link where High-School Chemistry has been discussed.

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=10600

I'm interested in knowing if you did go the Spectrum route with your son and any additional thoughts. Thanks so much.

Hi Flo,
Just bumping this as I too, am curious!!

Hi Carrie,

I've been studying all the "old" Chemistry post and am really drawn to the suggestion you had in the link above of using the MTMM resources with Ellen McHenry's materials subbed in for the Evolution section to beef-up and earn credit. And adding the Chemistry 101 DVD's on the 5th day.

As time has passed - do you still "like" this idea. The son I'm exploring this for is very science minded and 4-year bound in the area of Computer Science.

Thank you again.

Florence,

I'm so sorry it has taken me a bit to get back to the board. I have been knee-deep in the new guide writing the first week of formal plans, and I have missed some posts I need to answer! So, I appreciate your patience.

With my oldest this year in Chemistry, we did order the Spectrum Chemistry. The text had gone into a revision and was very delayed in its release (3-4 months) to the point that we only received photocopied, loose-leaf black and white pages of the first few chapters with which we were to start our year. While this was a bit of a disappointment, when we received our kit, unfortunately one of the test tube's contents had opened up and spilled all over the interior of our kit. So, as I pulled out the kit to begin planning its use and opened the box, white powdered chemical flew everywhere.

I, then began reading the warnings on the tube which was now empty of the chemical, and it had all sorts of warning for not inhaling, not getting it on your skin, etc. Well, by then, both my son and I were covered, so we took the box outside and tried to clean it off (because the warning said to get to a well ventilated area if exposed). It was on everything in the kit, and we both began to itch all over. Anyway, long story short that was the low point for me and Spectrum.

In pondering that my house has 4 active boys around whom the chemistry lab material will be used, and in finding more of the chemical powder on my counter and floor for awhile after we thought we'd cleaned it up, we decided to send back the Spectrum kit and text and begin anew. I know I was just running low on energy and my emotions were running high, because I am such a planner and I had to wait to plan my oldest son's school until the MTMM guide was done, but I could just tell that type of kit was not going to work for our family. Nor, did I desire to be on tenderhooks wondering when the rest of the book would come. I just couldn't wrap my mind around how to use the program with just part of the book in my hand. Anyway, I think Spectrum is a good program and that many families who use it enjoy it, I just knew for that moment in time I needed something else!

With this in mind, I went back to researching all possibly Chemistry options. My son went through the Chemistry 101 DVD's and loved them so much that my hubby watched them all too. So, those were a complete hit at our house.

Since my oldest had already been through the Chemistry we scheduled in MTMM, we had to go a different route from that. We ended up with Conceptual Chemistry by John Suchocki. It is an expensive, college level text (for non-science majors in college), yet it reads very narratively and has companion videos on the author's website to go with the lessons. We ordered a lab manual that can be used with it, but found it very intensive to use. So, we've instead settled on doing all of the experiments Suchocki includes in his text. They are lower key, but very doable and do a great job of demonstrating real-life chemistry principles. For us, this has been a good fit. I'm not sure whether we'll use this or something else for Chemistry in our high school guides, however it has been a great year in chemistry for my 11th grader.

Blessings,
Carrie

This was our experience with Spectrum Chemistry as well. I had to keep calling to get my order and barely got it in time to start school last year. We did finally receive it when I said that I wanted to cancel the order. We ended up switching to Apologia. I think the Apologia was very hard, and I would have liked some hand holding.

I will be keeping my eye on HOD's HS Chemistry choice in the future!!!

Just wanted to jump in and say because of one of Carrie's old posts I did order Spectrum Chemistry, the new and updated text is done and it shipped quickly. I sent some emails with some questions and got very quick responses from the company. I have a science-minded kid and this looks quite promising. I haven't ordered the lab kit yet. Just wanted to say I have been impressed with the service and product I got, so perhaps once they got this revision complete and out they were able to get back on track. If you have a science-minded kid and need to work beyond what HOD can provide for science for high school right now, don't hesitate to give Spectrum another look.

Carrie,

Thank you for taking the time to reply. Your comments along with the other posts are very helpful to us as we discern.

As I've been researching I've noticed that quite a few people outside of HOD have used the Integrated Chemistry and Physics over a 2 year period with 2 labs to earn a credit in Chemistry and Physics. Since the son I'm pondering Chemistry options for did not used the science in MTMM or the 101 DVD's I'm wondering if their might be a possibility among all of these resources to earn a credit in chemistry? He has completed 2 HS sciences with labs at this point: Earth Science and Biology. He did Apologia Physical Science as an 8th grader.

deltagal,

This is a very good question! From my perspective, in visiting with the publishers and having them share that the text in the IPC course is geared toward 9th graders (and I think could easily stretch to include 10th graders or even older learners who have had to wait a bit on higher level science for their math to catch up), I would be very hesitant to use it as the only text for two full credits of the higher level high school sciences like a typical chemistry and physics. The content coverage is very good for the 9th and 10th grade level to which it is geared, and it is extremely narrative which is such a breath of fresh air. However, it includes very little math and few scientific formulas, which is why it is best used in the early high school years. This is also why it is so important to add a good strong lab component to IPC.

Often, chemistry and physics are done in high school in 11th and 12th grades, and I would not consider the IPC course equivalent to the chemistry and physics texts available from other publishers for those grade levels. It is definitely a good introduction to chemistry and physics and a wonderful course to study prior to biology, because it is great to have some chemistry before biology, but it is not the same as a more typical full course in chemistry (or a full course in physics).

This is why scheduling IPC as an introduction to chemistry and physics works very well, yet I would not want students to have this be their only experience in chemistry (or the higher level sciences). In mentioning that the course can be 2 full high school credits, it's also good to know that this is mainly in cases where kiddos are struggling learners, or are unable to perform the math needed to do higher level science coursework any other way. While it is true there are students who need these types of adjustments, it is not true of all students. So, if your child falls into this category in the maths or sciences, you could pursue a differing path than what we would typically recommend. I just want to make sure that those who are pondering using this course understand why we have scheduled it the way we do in the World Geography guide, and why we are awarding one full credit with lab for the course's completion.

It is so important that we have our students be as prepared as possible for any future plans the Lord may have for them, and the sciences are one area in which course content and textual difficulty can really vary! I want to be sure in pursuing a more living science education that we don't fall short of preparing our kiddos in the sciences, and I also want to be sure that we don't award more credit than is due for completion of subject matter. So, from my perspective after using all of Integrated Physics and Chemistry with my oldest son as a freshman, and adding in a full weekly lab along with it, I found the hours required to complete the coursework with lab to fall firmly within the time required to earn one full credit of Integrated Physics and Chemistry with lab.

It do think it may be possible in your unique situation to use some of the Chemistry from MTMM (since you haven't already done it) and combine it with the Chemistry part of IPC along with the Chemistry 101 DVD's and some sort of chemistry lab to earn credit in Chemistry. Much of this will depend on what your child's future plans are after high school, as to whether this type of a plan will be enough to prepare him for what he desires to do career-wise. It also isn't something we typically recommend as that would mean by following this plan, and adding some of IPC to the MTMM science, families would actually be taking away the opportunity of doing the IPC science (because they could not use the IPC as written once they get to the World Geography guide).

In looking ahead, it will be harder to find enough to add to the IPC to make the physics portion credit-worthy the next year, compared to what a typical 11th or 12th grader would study in this area. But that doesn't mean it can't be done, if you have time and energy to search out possibilities. I realize since the HOD guides were not written for high school earlier that families are having to cobble together some areas that normally could just have been done the way we are currently writing them into our guide. So, your question definitely makes sense to me as you ponder your options.

Blessings,
Carrie

Carrie,

Thank you.

I am just exploring how I can maximize resources. As always your thoughts are quite helpful. The
son in question is very science ninded and anticipates working toward a 4 year degree in information systems.

My son and I both like the looks of Suchoki's Conceptual Chemistry. And the author graduated from VCU! I think I will explore this route further.

Thank you again.

Carrie,

I wanted to share with you that I've been in touch with John Suchoki. I feel pretty confident we'll go this route based on my conversations with him this a.m. Instructor accessibility is a real PLUS! I'm a big believer that customer service offsets costs ; )