Dilemma, Placement, Confusion

[shera]

I am currently using Preparing for my ds and Beyond for my dd. They both listen in on the others readings ( story time and history) as we sit at one table and do schoolwork. I have a few questions/concerns about next year.

First, my ds has horrible handwriting. I am currently using Dianne Craft's figure 8 exercises, HWOT cursive and I write out the scriptures in the Independent History in highlighted and have him trace it. I am concerned that he won't be able to handle the writing in CtC. he would ruin the beautiful note booking pages. I plan to teach him to type but that won't work with the notebook pages.

Second, I'm not sure if his ability to get thoughts on paper is good enough for CtC. here is his written narration from week 20. In John's vision he saw that God made everything that happens to defeat Satan. Satan had tried so hard but failed to win. Satan will lose against God in the war and Satan will be thrown into Hell's fire pit. Is this okay?

My ds says he is tired of Ancients. To give some background this is what we have done: For first we did SL core k. Second we tried Bigger but he was unable to even answer the simplest questions regarding the Eggleston readings so we dropped it. Third SL core 1 which is Ancient history. We ended up dropping that and switching to SOTW 1.

My thoughts for next year: combine ds and dd in Bigger using extensions and try to get his handwriting and writing better so the following year he could do CtC since he will have completed Preparing. He hasn't had much US History so it wouldn't be a repeat. Try to use CtC but modify it. I'm not sure how I would modify the writing though. The only other thought I have is to try a different curriculum. He has not enjoyed the history projects and doesn't like to draw or paint.

Also, did I mess up by having my ds and dd listen in on each others history and story time. They have not done any of the activities, just listened to the stories. I'm concerned because in 2 years my dd will be doing Preparing and hearing everything again.

What do you think?

[chillin'inandover]

I will attempt to address a few of your concerns. I am sure that if you feel you have made errors in your day having dc listen to history you can either stop doing that or continue. My ds is starting to remember more things and a repeat might be an ok thing. After asking the same 4 questions in storytime for 1 year in preparing and repeating this for modified CTC he realised at about week 13 that I was asking the same questions-he didn't notice it before. Twice in one day we read about the Yellow River and mapped it he made a connection-a first! If you stop the reading it would free up more time for dc to address specific learning needs rather than fatigue dc listening to storytime twice in one day. So ultimately the answer lies in whether listening to history is adding to positively or taking from negatively dc learning.

Another issue was in regard to dc handwriting. Since you are addressing the problem area with extra work you may want to cut back on the handwriting required-ease into it so to speak. I have read that some ladies write one line then child writes the next line. Is dc doing cursive or manuscript? My ds was not finished with cursive in Preparing as it has taken two years to complete cheerful cursive so that required adaptation of his work. Cursive is included in Bigger plans. Manuscript is included in Beyond plan so the writing may be better addressed in this guide that you are currently using. The guides are written to develop skills gently so if dc is being stretch too much it may cause grumbling.

When looking toward CTC and those beautiful student pages I have seen dc type and paste onto student pages so that is do-able in the future if writing is still a challenge.

Looking at written narration I will state that my ds has had big time trouble with that too so I modified Preparing by providing more assistance than suggested. I realised that written narration gets progressively more difficult so rather than continue to CTC guide I have created my own guide and ds is learning to do written narration correctly. In Week 22 he is has made progress and is ready for CTC but wants to finish the year. I would recommend checking the placement charts because dc might not have the skills needed for Preparing and might be better skillwise in Beyond-according to your post- but you know dc best!

Many have gone back and forth on curriculum and I believe if we are listening to Holy Spirit it isn't a mistake or something to regret, but it happened for a reason. Move forward and know the Lord meets our needs and our dc needs including their academic needs. Tammy

[LynnH]

I can address the writing issue in that I am one who has a son with dysgraphia due to Cerebral Palsy so he types all of his written narrations and we glue them in the notebooking pages. He also types other things as well and it works out fine. He does do any verse copywork in cursive in his notebook although I still have to write it in cursive on the board so he can model it. I also draw lines in his notebooking pages so he has some guidance when writing his letters. If you go to my blog that is by my signature you can see examples of his work in RTR this year and if you go back to last years posts you can see CTC. However reading your post it does sound as if he might struggle with CTC in other areas. CTC is a big jump from Preparing. The readings are much more challenging. How has he done with the Independent reading in Preparing? If he struggles with that then I would hesitate to move him up. Written narrations are expected to be longer in CTC and it moves from asking questions that guide that narration to having them come up with the narration without guidance. As far as your concern about him being tired of Ancients I will say CTC presents Ancients in a very different way. There is a big focus on bible history and how that connects with the history of the rest of the ancient world.
I know it usually isn't recommended to move back a guide, but each situation is different. Hopefully Carrie or Julie will see this and offer some advice for you.

[Tidbits of Learning]

I have a few questions/concerns about next year.

First, my ds has horrible handwriting. I am currently using Dianne Craft's figure 8 exercises, HWOT cursive and I write out the scriptures in the Independent History in highlighted and have him trace it. I am concerned that he won't be able to handle the writing in CtC. he would ruin the beautiful note booking pages. I plan to teach him to type but that won't work with the notebook pages.

The handwriting would be my biggest issue with moving forward with CTC. There is a lot of writing around the board with CTC not just on the notebooking pages. I think it is recommended after they learn cursive to do a full year of cursive before giving them the choice except when it says cursive.

Second, I'm not sure if his ability to get thoughts on paper is good enough for CtC. here is his written narration from week 20. In John's vision he saw that God made everything that happens to defeat Satan. Satan had tried so hard but failed to win. Satan will lose against God in the war and Satan will be thrown into Hell's fire pit. Is this okay?

The written narrations in CTC are recommended to be 5 to 8 sentences long I believe. It does give you a starter prompt which can be helpful. Do you think your son can do at least 5 sentence narrations with a prompt?

My thoughts for next year: combine ds and dd in Bigger using extensions and try to get his handwriting and writing better so the following year he could do CtC since he will have completed Preparing. He hasn't had much US History so it wouldn't be a repeat.

How far are you in Preparing? I am asking b/c you are still tracing for him and I am curious how far you are into it and whether he has completed a year with cursive instruction. I saw in a previous post that you are using HWOT cursive. Have you completed it?
If you are less than 1/2 way through Preparing, I am going to throw up a new suggestion. Since he is listening in to Beyond with his sister anyway, stop Preparing and combine the 2 in Beyond. You could work on his handwriting by doing the poetry copywork 1 line at a time. If you like this option, there is some notebooking pages that others have made to go with Beyond that I did use with my 2 dd's last year when they were 9 and 10 and combined with their younger brother in Beyond. I will say that my dd10 (9 last year) made huge strides in her handwriting with the copywork and notebooking that we did with Beyond. Her writing is so much better this year. Keep his language arts, math, and reading where they are right now.

Try to use CtC but modify it. I'm not sure how I would modify the writing though. The only other thought I have is to try a different curriculum. He has not enjoyed the history projects and doesn't like to draw or paint.

Since he doesn't know how to type right now, I would say it might be hard to modify CTC and you would lose some of the independence he should gain with this guide by moving up.

Also, did I mess up by having my ds and dd listen in on each others history and story time. They have not done any of the activities, just listened to the stories. I'm concerned because in 2 years my dd will be doing Preparing and hearing everything again.

I don't think it is bad that they have been listening in on each other's work exactly. I think if you do like my previous idea that it will benefit that he has been listening in on the Beyond readings.

What do you think?

From what you have wrote, I would try to stop Preparing and drop him back to Beyond with his sister. You could do Bigger with extensions as written next year and finish out cursive instruction or have him start his year of writing everything in cursive by himself. If you want, you can pm me and I will send you the notebooking pages we used with the older girls with Beyond. You could then either see if he places in CTC after finishing Bigger or you could keep them combined and have them go through Preparing again together with him doing extensions.
I jumped both my girls up to CTC this year after combining with Beyond for all 3 olders last year. I do not regret combining last year as I feel the girls really gained certain skills. We did add in Zoology 1 with notebooking for their science. They were reading the science independently. The year in Beyond with them doing their own math, language arts, and reading did help them to mature and for my dd who was 9 at the time...it did wonders on her ability to write, how much she could write, and how long she could write without complaining or without it getting messy. I did ask all the questions from the CLP history books as well and have the girls answer them orally which I think helped with their narrating this year.
While they did Beyond, they also did typing on the computer. I would suggest doing typing as well. We did a fun typing from Disney that my kids loved called Timon and Pumba typing. I think they have spongebob typing out now.
I did see in your previous posts from last year that at one point you were going to go with Bigger with extensions this year b/c of maturity and writing, but changed your mind somewhere along the way. For me, if he wasn't doing Preparing exactly as written then I wouldn't keep moving forward. I would drop back, regroup, focus on weak areas, and then in a year after completing Bigger assess and see where he is then.
Anyway, that would be my suggestion that instead of pushing forward to take a step back and see if it would be better to combine them and work consistently on getting his handwriting and narrating skills mastered.

[shera]

we are currently in Unit 22 of Preparing, so we have completed a large portion of the program. He is able to read all of the independent history and science. He could even read CHOW, Grandpa's Box and the Storytime books; but I don't let him. In my original post I included a copy of his written narration. I'm not sure if the quality of the writing is good or not. It seems to me, he is having problems with the physical act of writing. He is still working on learning cursive, so anyplace in the manual it says write in cursive I have let him print. We just recently started with the figure 8 exercises and even more recently with tracing. So other than the type of writing, I would say he is able to follow the Preparing guide well. Sometimes I have to remind him to actually read and follow then directions or do the assignment vs. Just read the pages listed in the book, but that seems more of a training issue vs. Inability to do the work.

[LynnH]

Ok now that I have read your response it does sound similar to my son with the dysgraphia. We did the figure 8 exercises at one point also. My ds has trouble with the physical act of writing as well as processing how to form the letters. I think the figure 8 exercises helped with how to form the letters so that it is more automatic and he doesn't have to think so hard about it. Since he has Cerebral Palsy the physical act of writing will always be a challenge for him although he has shown progress. His endurance is much better now for writing due to the copywork in HOD. Also the drawing in Draw and Write Through History has really helped. I think you could do CTC if you work on typing this summer as well as finish your cursive program. You could then make very similar adjustments to what I have made. You said he doesn't like painting, drawing or the projects. As a pediatric physical therapist by trade I would say that could also be because it is challenging due to the difficulty with his fine motor skills. I would strongly suggest you have him do these things. They will help build up his hand muscles and in turn help his writing.

[Tidbits of Learning]

After reading your last post, he sounds ready to move to CTC. I thought his narration was well written actually. I don't always have my dd10 write in cursive on the notebooking pages. I only have her do the parts that say write in cursive. I wouldn't stress keeping the notebooking pages pretty either. We have had to erase and redo sections and it hasn't made them unreadable or less appealing to the eye. I misunderstood and thought you were tracing for him a lot.

[blessedmomof4]

Another thing you could do for the notebooking pages in CTC is to let him type-you can format a Word doc to whatever size you need, then print, cut, and paste. I let my 14 year old dd do that at first and it looks ok. Others have had their child write the narration on lined paper and the fold and paste it in, because their child writes large. Whatever works

[birchbark]

If I were you I'd slow Preparing down to half-speed (continuing with math and LA daily) to give him more time to work on his writing before he hits CTC.