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What do you do with a child whose ability to memorize a dictation passage is well below their ability to spell words? This child could probably spell every word in this post, for example, but give her more than one sentence in a passage, and she panics.

catbeth wrote:What do you do with a child whose ability to memorize a dictation passage is well below their ability to spell words? This child could probably spell every word in this post, for example, but give her more than one sentence in a passage, and she panics.

Are you talking about your six year old? I could be wrong, but it seems to me that she may be better served to do one of the spelling lists in Beyond or Bigger instead of dictation. If the first Beyond list is really easy for her, maybe the harder Beyond list would work? I think it's okay (and maybe preferred) for Spelling to not be super challenging for a six-year-old. It seems to me that the dictation passages would be extremely challenging for her. Also, I believe the dictation passages are meant to be studied, but not memorized.

Hopefully others will chime in with their opinions also!

The spelling lists are too easy. It would be busy work for her. I don't have time to make her do busy work.

She's not memorizing the dictation, she's only studying it the way the guide instructs. She just panics and forgets how the passage starts by the time she has to write it.

Today was the first time to have 3 sentences. "See the black clouds in the west. The rain is near. Let us run." I ended up having to repeat it for her. Then after she wrote the first sentence, she panicked and couldn't remember the rest. I read the second sentence for her, and she was able to finish. When I checked it, she had done everything correctly, except that she wrote "See the black clouds in the sky." I told her that since it was her first time to have 3 sentences, I would give her a break and not make her repeat.

Again, the spelling is really easy for her. She has only made about 3 or 4 spelling mistakes all year. I don't see her making any progress in spelling ability, though, because all the words are review for her.

Adding to my previous post....

I agree with you that dictation is too difficult for her. But the spelling lists are too easy. What I need are harder spelling lists. NOT because I'm trying to make things "hard," but so she'll learn something. It makes no more sense to give her super-duper easy spelling lists than it does to make her add 1+1 and 2+2 over and over again. I did try it at the beginning of the year (using the second list), and dd was insulted, because it was so much easier than the phonics-based spelling program she had last year.

catbeth wrote:Adding to my previous post....

I agree with you that dictation is too difficult for her. But the spelling lists are too easy. What I need are harder spelling lists. NOT because I'm trying to make things "hard," but so she'll learn something. It makes no more sense to give her super-duper easy spelling lists than it does to make her add 1+1 and 2+2 over and over again. I did try it at the beginning of the year (using the second list), and dd was insulted, because it was so much easier than the phonics-based spelling program she had last year.

Personally, if I were in your situation, I just wouldn't worry about spelling/dictation with her just yet. If she can already do the spelling lists easily, then she must have an excellent visual memory. I doubt she would be harmed in any way by just waiting a while to do dictation ... but that's just me, and I tend to be a little laid back about these things.

I also might be likely to do one of the spelling lists with her, even though it's easy. The simple activities that Carrie plans for the spelling lists are fun, skill-building, and super-quick! I'm currently doing the harder spelling list from Beyond now with my 7 year old (along with the 5th day gentle grammar lessons) and it literally takes us 5 minutes a day. She is a great natural speller (unlike her big brother), but I'm still doing these spelling lessons with her. Usually she already knows how to spell all but one or maybe two of the words, and that's okay with me.

It is so hard to know what to do when you have a child that's outside the norm. My oldest struggles greatly with academics, and my 7 year old flies through or is ahead in most areas. Each child is so different, and when they don't follow what's typical, it's very hard to know how to proceed. Trust me, I'm really struggling with knowing how much to require of my ten-year-old who struggles. I've just prayed for wisdom for you!

I let my daughter study the passage first then I read only a portion of the passage (usually not even the whole first sentence). I think (and I could be wrong) that the idea behind dictation is to see how the words are spelled, how punctuation is used, and capitalization. As such, I don't think it's necessary for them to remeber how it starts or what the next sentence is. You may try just reading the first sentence and after she writes that one, read the next one, and so on. I hope this helps.

Yes, dictate it a phrase at a time-a sentence or shorter, if need be. We shouldn't ever be working toward reading/dictating the whole passage at once.

Agreeing with the pp. The way you ended up doing it is more like how it is supposed to be done. You only read a phrase at a time and they say it back to you and write it and then move to the next phrase etc. I think in classical education the emphasis is different in that they are supposed to be able to do the entire thing and the focus is on remembering all of it. I remember in a previous post Carrie said that is one difference between Charlotte Mason dictation and Classical dictation. Charlotte Mason is more concerned with the spelling, punctuation etc. My ds is 12 and I still do it a phrase at a time for him.

Hi, again, catbeth!

I want to make sure you don't feel like I'm trying to give you a hard time! I wish that I had pushed my oldest less when he was 3, 4, 5, and 6 so I may be projecting that onto you. Every situation is different and you know your daughter like no one else!

Thanks for all the gracious replies from everyone. Heart_Mom, believe me, I am constantly struggling with the balance between academic appropriateness and age-appropriateness. I have pushed too hard in the past, and am trying not to do that now. I am trying only to meet my daughter where she is. In each subject, I have 4 options:

1. Do typical grade-level work for her, in this case the spelling list. It's age-appropriate, but not academically appropriate.
2. Do nothing, since she's ahead on spelling. Not a good option, because her spelling ability is like a muscle that needs some exercise in order not to atrophy. If she doesn't practice spelling, then she loses confidence and starts "forgetting" how to spell.
3. Push ahead on dictation, which is academically appropriate but not age appropriate.
4. Find a balance. According to several posters, it is okay to give her one sentence at a time. She would be ecstatic if I did this. She could focus on spelling and punctuation, without the stress of trying to remember 2 or 3 sentences.

Thanks for all the posts. I'm going to go with option 4 for awhile.

FWIW, I don't give my sixth grader more than one sentence at a time - and he has been flourishing through the years with dictation done in this manner. In fact, he rarely makes mistakes in his spelling within his written narrations, etc. Who would have thought, from such humble beginnings?!? For young dc, dictation is meant to be given a phrase at a time. It helps me to read through the tips in the Appendix for dictation. I'd definitely give dictation one phrase at a time, and let dd bloom. She will. She sounds like a smart little pumpkin!

In Christ,
Julie

I agree with the other posters. When we do dictation, I have my ds study the passage. When he's ready, I remove the passage and give him the first sentence. He repeats it back to me and then writes it. Next, I say the second sentence, he repeats it back to me, and then he writes it. We follow the same pattern with the last sentence. After the sentences, I dictate one word at a time from the spelling words that are below the passage. Like Julie, I've seen my ds make great strides doing it this way.

Thanks for clarifying, Julie! It's so nice to have this board!