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Hi. I need some wisdom from you wonderful women! I have 4 kids. 7, 5, 3, 18 months. This is our first year homescholing. My dd 7 is a gem. A parents wildest dream. My ds 5 is wonderful but difficult. Resistant to learn or really do anything I ask of him. I end up letting him call the shots...doing school work when he is ready. I find it much more pleasant this way. We got up early today and I thought, "hey, lets get school done so we can get outside for some fun." So we began at 8. By 830 they were both complaining...this is taking too long. THIRTY MINUTES. I almost came unglued. Just two nights ago, we had a family meeting where my dh stated. "your mom does not have to do this. I would rather you go to school and have a happy wife and mother than come home to this nonsense." They both agreed that homeschool is their choice and promised to do better. So it obviously had little impact.
Here are a few questions.... am I making a bad choice by letting ds 5 decide when he does work? I probably am. I say on a daily basis, "hey, this can take a short time, or take all day, you decide." Do I need to get a little tougher on him and require that he do what he needs to do when i say? Ive heard other moms say not to worry, just keep trying and he will pick up on it and get excited. aarrgghh. I just dont know what to do.
For dd 7, what about this bad attitude after such a short time of work? She is easily frustrated and they are both so moody. Hmmm, wonder where they get that from. eeek. I knew homeschooling wasnt the magic bullet but one of the reasons we started this was to improve family relationships and behavior and its just not happening yet. I feel like I threaten taking them back to school all the time. They definitely dont want that but nothing Im doing is helping.

Im sure some of you, heck, maybe all of you have been thru this. I could continue to describe whats going on but Im fairly certain this is common. Thoughts and ideas are very much appreciated!! Many thanks in advance.

First of all, I just wanted to say, 7, 5, 3 and 18 months! WoW!!!! You have a full plate right there. There is also a huge learning curve the first year of homeschooling. I will let the other ladies who are more seasoned give you some advice, I really don't know if it is right or wrong to let him do it at his own pace. Both of my boys 7 and 5 are this way. My dd 5 is completely the opposite. She can't get enough of school.

So, you are not alone. I've been there and I'm still there on some days. In our house, rules and consistency work best. Are you doing LHFHG with your 5 year old. Maybe you could go at half speed. I know my 5 year old ds wouldn't be quite ready for LHFHG full speed. He is more interested in playing. Also, I would work with him first and then let him play.

HTH,
Tracy

A few thoughts:
I would make sure they are both accurately placed. Perhaps the 5 yr old would be better at 1/2 pace? I have an almost 5 yr old with whom we have decided to wait until 6 for Little Hearts, yet our other son did wonderful at barely 5.

I may or may not let my children decide when they are to do something, depending on what it is. Things that are important and have to do with responsibility are decided by mommy and daddy. Now, they may decide not to do X appropriately or without whining, and if that is the case they will sit on the couch or on their bed until they can come out with a willing and cheerful spirit. So I guess they may be partially deciding when they do it, but they are not enjoying themselves in the meantime. If it were schoolwork, they would do the make up work according to mommy's schedule and might have to miss their afternoon playtime or some other activity if that is when mommy can best fit it in.

A schedule of some sort would probably help so they know what to expect. It doesn't have to be rigid - I absolutely cannot use a schedule that tells me when I have to do something, but a schedule that says in what order things will be done can be really helpful to both mom and kiddos. It doesn't hurt to include a short break somewhere for younger children and they have that to look forward to.

There is a lot of training involved with homeschooling, and really, if you think about it, that is why many of us homeschool - so we can be with our children to work on those little character flaws Hang in there. Not every day will be perfect, but your homsechool can become a "well-oiled machine" with time and work and it is worth all the effort.

I know that there will be some more lovely ladies to add to what has already been said. I agree with countrymom on placement being very important. Where are your dc placed? I also had the same experience with my boys as countrymom. I had two do school work great right after turning 5. Then I experienced a little more resistance in my now 5 yr old. We did LHTH with him all last year and even through the summer and I thought "this kid is never going to learn his ABC's ".... well the last week of school (in August) all of a sudden he knew his whole alphabet sounds and all??????? I just think they are each very differant and we just kinda have to wait on them. So maybe like countrymom said, you could try taking him half pace just to start off? If it is just that he is a wiggle worm and does not want to sit still, then I would probably still have him do it but spread it out into short increments during the day. Like do phonics, then have him do something where he is not just sitting there, maybe the Rhymes in Motion box, then have him do an activity that you have set out just for school (like cars or blocks, or hey go jump on the trampoline for 10 minutes), then read a little more...etc.

One more thing I thought I would share, I have noticed at my house that if we do not do school first thing after breakfast, then NO ONE is interested, not even myself . So we make an effort to start school as soon as possible. You could try a sticker chart and if they have a good day without whining or complaining each day of the week for one week, let them pick a special activity... maybe icecream or making cookies or even a trip to the park (just some ideas) or watching a family movie? Oh and I don't know if the little ones take naps, but that has been a wonderful time for us to finish up things that are just to hard to do with the distractions. I had one more thought, you could get the 7yr old to play with the little ones in short increments and near by to get something done with the 5yr old.

Thank you for the quick replies. I didnt even bother buying a guide for ds this year. I knew my dd would do well but decided to get math and phonics (math u see and explode the code) and just work on those. I figured I would have trouble getting him to work on just those two things and I was right. My dd 3 is a brainiac and she will be ready to be in the same guide as ds next year. In fact, I fear she will pass him up!! DD7 is in Beyond and I think we made the right choice. Some stuff is easy for her and we supplement but I couldnt imagine going to Bigger.

The little ones do nap and we do get some good time in there and I kind of bank on that time. Oy this is hard!!! I dont know how some of you have done this for so long. Saints in the making for sure!! I know God has called me to do this and all I have to do is watch the news to confirm I am doing the right thing but boy, I wish I had some cooperation. I dont think they will realize how big of a deal this is until they are adults. I just hope I survive that long!!

Hi!

My kids are very close in age to yours (all girls though and I only have 3 that are giving me trouble, #4 is still in the womb!), main difference for me is that this will be the 3rd year of homeschooling for us and my kids don't know any different. I agree with what others have said, the transition to a homeschool routine and what is expected of them is probably your biggest struggle right now. I think you really need to not worry about how much schoolwork gets done in a day, and focus yourself on the fact that you are establishing a routine and laying down behavior patterns and expectations that will serve you for as long as you are homeschooling (and probably for the rest of the time you are parenting too, even if you don't homeschool for very long). It is hard, it is stressful, pray to God for patience and wisdom in how to address things and what needs to be addressed first, how to move along.

But I would say the things that make my day go well are having a very solid routine in place. I have it planned down to what order we do the different boxes in, because that dictates whether my 2YO is in the room with us or whether she is being entertained/entertaining herself somewhere else. But I would say even having your blocks of time set apart for school time is a good start. Because of the way Beyond is written you can certainly break this up throughout the day if that works for you. Save the things that are difficult or require that you not be interrupted for naptime (for us this would be my DD6's reading and the things I read to them, DD4 listens to storytime, history, devotion, but she loves to listen to reading, your son may not). But I found that the afternoon time was not good for anything that is difficult for my children or that they don't like to do. We actually do everything in the morning, but when I don't want to be interrupted my DD2 is supposed to be in her room and I play music for her, give her interesting toys that she doesn't usually get to have all to herself (I say supposed to - lately she's taken to letting herself out and wandering the house, we are currently working on this).

The routine cuts down on the arguing. Although every morning my kids still ask me "Mom are we doing school today?" even though they know the answer! I say "Yes." My 4YO especially has taken to saying "aww, I don't like school." I just today told her she's not allowed to say that, she's allowed to say something positive or nothing at all. I do feel like the attitude with which the work is done is important. There is very little of Beyond that my DD6 doesn't like, but for those things she struggles in she does have a terrible attitude sometimes. I do like another person already said, actually I do it like this. First of all for copywork, if she does it with a bad attitude she has to do more of it. Anything she is basically having a sour attitude and sulking her way through, I give her a timer with 5 minutes and I tell her, "please go to your room. If you can come back when this timer goes off and do your work with a good attitude then you may come back, if not start the timer again." She is always back in 5 minutes. Of course we talk about (as is emphasized actually in several of the memory verses and Bible lessons in Beyond) why its important to do all things to the best of our ability and with a good attitude, because we are working for the Lord, not for men. I will note that my children don't have many toys or books or other fun things in their room, even though they do like to play in there, when they are sent there for a bad attitude they do see that as a punishment and they take it seriously. That wouldn't work for everyone.

Obviously you and your husband are still trying to figure out if this whole thing is going to work or not. But I would actually refrain from talking about or threatening sending them to school in front of the children. I think I read or heard somewhere, that yes, you do a trial period but as far as your children know you should have committed before them to do homeschool for X amount of time without questioning it at all. Good or bad, no matter how ugly it gets. Kind of like in marriage, if there's no way out, you figure out a way to work it out! Obviously again there comes a point where you may decide that going to school is really in everyone's best interests. That's a decision you and your husband make behind the scenes, the children shouldn't necessarily think they have much if any power in that.

With your 5YO I would require him to do school every day to get used to the fact that it is required of him and is not optional, and that at times he will be asked to do something he doesn't want to do when he doesn't want to do it and he should obey. But choose your battles, because at that age I would see it as more important to make learning interactive and fun, to whet the appetite for all of the exciting things he can learn and do. I would assess whether what you are doing with him now meets those needs and if not I would change it. Make the point, make sure he knows that its important and you won't back down, but don't fight him all day long either. I just don't think it would be worth it. If problems are very serious with his obedience, his father should be involved as well, but hopefully with a gentle and fun approach that doesn't become necessary often.

Just a few thoughts for you. You have gotten some wonderful advice here already! I personally would NOT allow your 5 year old to choose when he does his work. It sounds like that his personality type needs pretty tough boundaries. Interestingly the more lee-way or choices you give to this more head-strong type of child, the more they will run with it and the more unbearable they will be to live with. (My oldest is like this! I know believe me!) He needs tighter boundaries and a clear schedule of what is expected of him each day. I know he is only 5, but believe me, you will notice much better behavior in the long run if he is on a consistent and unchanging routine (except for special days, etc.). The problem is that HE is calling the shots, and he is taking more authority in your home that what he should. I say this in full understanding and love, believe me, I have been there. But he will run ALL OVER you and constantly give you grief if you don't get him under control and authority.

We all have various beliefs on child training, so I won't go into detail on that here. Yet, his attitude should be dealt with or it will make you want to give up homeschooling. The first and most important thing to work on the first year of homeschooling is their character, in my opinion. The first year is THE MOST difficult year of all and having your children obedient is of the utmost importance in being able to teach them. He HAS to know you are IN CHARGE, or he will not respect or listen to you, and schooling will be no fun for anyone. There are some wonderful parenting books out there to help, and obviously seeking the Lord's wisdom is the most important of all. So, it's time to buckle down and give your son some boundaries and a schedule daily. And this will be expected of him, or he will face consequences. The Word says that if we love our sons, we will discipline them, so let us rise up and love our sons in the way they need! Bless you always, sister. You can do this with the strength of Jesus!

I know that you posted somewhere that you are doing explode the code and math u see with your son. I was just wandering (i am not a salesperson for HOD), if it is in your budget to do LHFHG with him? I think you would love it, and there are so many activities and fun things to keep him interesting.. he might just start to beg you to do his school If you were able to do this then you could just start off half pace with him and go full pace when he was ready (i mean showing more interest and excitement)! If it is not in your budget then i would have him do those things you have and find some "fun" things to add in, like dot to dot or cut and paste books or printables? Or as he is learning numbers draw big numbers and have him glue different items to the number? Just some thoughts. When my 5yr old learned that he could read a book himself or to his brother if he would do his school, he was thrilled! He begs me to do phonics first? This is the same child that spent one whole year learning his letters and did not know what w said a couple of weeks ago? He loved LHTH but just did not remember his letters and sounds (or so I thought). Anyway, I have prayed for you and your family, God will give you what you need!

Again, thank you for taking the time for these replies. These boards are truly an amazing part of this curriculum. very grateful.
I read each reply and felt like there was some excellent wisdom in each one. This morning, I expressed my desire and requirement of getting back on our morning chore schedule. They did pretty well. I told ds 5, "you can do these things now, or when we get a break at 1030." If looks could kill Id be dead but he did it. We did math at the kitchen table while I cleaned up and it was a success until the baby spilled a drink everywhere. Argh, such is life I guess. But everyone was joyful and cooperative. We went for a bike ride to enjoy the fall weather. It doesnt last long so we need to make the most of it. Got home, did a little more school work and then had lunch. Was the education great? Probably not, but we enjoyed eachother for the most part and I felt better about everyone in general. The little ones are napping now and I have a client (im a nap time hair dresser) and dd 7 will finish up for the day. As far as my strong willed 5 yo, I spoke quietly and firmly and let him know what I expected of him today and he really did a great job. I think the bike ride helped a lot. I need to remember that we all need to get outside and play!!!

I think I will order a guide for him. I was hoping to do one of them (cant remember the names right now) next year with both him and my dd 3. I think he would take ownership of his own guide and be proud. Too bad HOD guides dont have a Star Wars logo on the front. Then hed be all over it. haha.

So thank you again. I really appreciate it. I think he does need firm boundaries and character building first. I will check in later and let you all know how we are doing!!! Many blessings, sarah

Sarah, It sounds like you will do great!

We went for a bike ride to enjoy the fall weather. It doesnt last long so we need to make the most of it.

This is one of the reasons we homeschool! It is important to remember (it was hard for me at first), we do not have to do it just like a classroom (if we dont want to)... we can take advantage of pretty weather and daddy days (what we call when daddy is home at our house) or any such things when they arise!!!

My kids are very similar ages so I can relate to you on this. I just want to add that it is never a good idea to threaten our children with things. Either do it or don't kwim. I would not be telling them that you are going to send them back to school as a threat. As for the complaining, my oldest is quite the complainer and I really have to be on top of him about it. We have done a variety of consequences from chores to running laps, and he has improved greatly. I tell him he doesn't have to enjoy everything we do but he does need to do it without complaining. For your 5 year old I would require daily work, but I would start small and build. There is a ton of discipline and training involved in homeschooling beyond just the book work, and I find I need just as much discipline and training myself to keep our school running smoothly. Sorry if any of this advice is a repeat I did not read every reply. I hope next week will go better for you all.

So happy to hear that your day went well and that you enjoyed one another! That is OVER half the battle!!! Blessings to you!

As I type, the baby is sleeping, the oldest is reading with Grama, and the 2 middles (Bonnie and Clyde as I like to call them) are painting like mad and actually getting along! I had a rough week when I first posted. I honestly felt I had made a big mistake in pulling them from school but God has confirmed our decision over.and over.
I bought a guide for my strong willed wild man and he loves it. We haven't gotten in a great schedule running the 2 guides but I know that will come. I also know that I will be posting again when I have 3 guides going at a time so be ready! How do you all do it? We are also working on behavior and obedience. How did they all end up as stubborn as their mother? Thank goodness there is so much character study built into the curriculum. What a blessing.
Just had to check in with gratitude for all of you and HOD! Blessings!

Great to hear you are doing better! Just wanted to pass along some wonderful advice that I got last year. I had also taken mine out of school the year before. Someone told me to go really easy the first year out of school, to let my children "deschool" and for us to just begin to bond together again as a family. That was very wise advice for me. Just don't push them too hard, and mainly focus more on the character training. The academics will come. Mainly do lots of fun bonding activities together; trips to the park, field trips, game days, etc. Blessings!

I am so Excited for you! Just that you are able to look back and remember that you are where you are because GOD called you there! I just wanted to share something that I always hold onto, not just for homeschool but anything... when we are trying to obey the enemy comes in and tries to steal our joy and peace so I remember this- remember in the darkness what HE has shone you in the light-.... anytime things are hard/dark I try to remember what God showed me last, so when the week gets challenging just remember what God showed your family to lead you to this place (perfect time for journaling). It is easier to fight the enemies lies (like you made a mistake pulling your kids out of school or you dont know what your doing and you are going to mess them up , when we can remember Gods truth(- whatever he confirmed homeschooling with, like a scripture or whatever-)! He will give us the strength to do what He has called us to do!! You are on a great path!