Skills need to start Preparing

[mom2boys030507]

I am planning on starting Preparing in the fall with two of my boys. I am wondering what skills we might be missing because we have not done Bigger. I remember reading something about vocabulary - something we have not really done, but could work on this spring.

I have been studying the placement chart - My middle places solidly into preparing, except for knowing cursive. So that will be one of the things I will be sure to pick up this spring. We will also be continuing to work on oral narration skills.

My oldest actually places into CTC but I don't want to miss the beginning written narration skills and I will add in the extension books if he is needing more of a challenge. I am not sure what to do for grammar for him as he will be at least half way through R&S 4 by the time I am planning to start. I am thinking I will just keep moving forward where we are at and write in my own lesson plan numbers.

Thanks for your help as I plan to start HOD with my boys in the fall.

[blessedmomof4]

It looks like you have a good plan in place! Prparing is a great guide that still gives plenty of guidance in the areas of narration and vocabulary, so if that is where your younger places solidly, it should be a great year, and adding Cursive will nicely round things out. The older will find lots to challenge him, and the Extensions can definitley add more if he needs it. The schedule and instructions for using the Extensions are found in the appendix of Preparing

[Mom2Monkeys]

By the dates in your siggy, are your boys 6 and 8 that you are considering putting in Preparing?? If so, I HIGHLY suggest reconsidering placement. These guides are way more meaty than they appear from the samples. And their ages are a big factor in placement. We can help you figure it all out.

[mom2boys030507]

Yes, my boys are currently 6 and 8, soon to be 7 and 9. My middle is young, but I do think he is ready and if it is notworking I will drop him back.

Currently, he is in Singapore 2B, R&S 2, doing dictation with Spelling Wisdom, Hey Andrew Teach Me Some Greek Level 3, reading with comprehension at a 4th or 5th grade level, and starting to write narrations about once per week. He is an advanced student, keeping up or close to passing his older brother. I have learner to not consider his age or grade when looking at curriculum. I just have to look at skill level and then once we start adjust the expected output to what his maturity level can handle.

I am, also, trying to figure out if you use the extension or the independent history. There are books in both that both my boys will want to do

[Mom2Monkeys]

I do want to caution you against usign PHFHG with a 6/7 yo. My gifted 10yo is in PHFHG right now and it's great...and CTC will be impossible for a 7/8yo. The skills are beyond academic. There's so much to the guides and books and how they are used, plus the skills taught within each guide. I really, really think you should call and speak with Carrie and tell her all about your son and his abilities andtalk about the next guides after PHFHG as well.

You could easily combine them in BHFHG with extensions for the older. I'd suggest not going above the Bigger Hearts level given his age, no matter his abilities. He will still be challenged and when he comes to the middle school guides after PHFHG, he will be able to do them. There are some threads on here about CTC that you may want to read. Peolple are finding it works best on the upper end of the age range for multiple reasons. It's also just too heavy a workload for his age. Carrie can really help you figure out what you want to do b/c let's face it...who knows the guides and skill requirements better than she does?!

[Mom2Monkeys]

I use the independent history and the extensions with my 10yo. The independent history is an integral part of the guide and skills being taught, so you'll want to do that. Then you can add in the extensions as desired.

[mom2boys030507]

Mom2monkeys, thank you for clearing up my confusion about the independent history and the extensions. It is helpful for me to know that both boys will do the independent history whether we use the extensions or not.

I understand you concerns about placing my middle in the Preparing Guide and I do appreciate them. I have been thinking about and reading the various threads on Preparing and CTC. Yet, last year I was in the same position when I wanted to place my boys in Bigger. Everyone here talked me out of it. Some saying my middle was to young, some saying my oldest was to young to even consider the extensions. I regret not taking the plunge last year. I am not going to make that mistake again this year. I am fully prepared to slow down the pace he does Preparing or dropping him back to Bigger if he really needs to. But, at this point he is doing about 4 hours per day - some of that is by his choice. He is capable of a lot and loves to have challenges to step up to. I understand that there may be issues in the future with maturity level but I have learned I need to decide year by year what we are doing my boys change to much each year to not do this. If I don't start HOD with my boys this fall and find out how it works for us, I will continue to drool over it. Now is the time for our family. I am really just trying to figure out if there are skills that I would be helpful for my boys to practice working on this spring because we didn't do Bigger this year.

[Mom2Monkeys]

You'll definitely want to get their oral narration skills going really well, and start training them about how to use the guide as their guide and work on the "I" boxes independently-- so basically they need to know how to read written directions and follow them step by step, exactly. They'll need to be able to write in cursive, copy longer passages in cursive, and you could start studied dictation. Don't worry about R&S 4...I'd honestly just slow that down b/c you are waaaay ahead in grammar and it would be great if your son was able to just follow the directions in the guide as-is without hopping around. The goal is to finish R&S 6 by end of 8th grade You could slow that down and use that time to do lots of oral narration practice and learn cursive. You could continue it of course, but I'd slow down the pace quite a bit so you can start CTC the following year with level 5, day one lesson one. Otherwise, once in the guides, just do the next lesson of R&S on the days grammar is scheduled. It will be half speed in CTC and up to make time for the additional writing load.

My thought has always been just b/c they CAN do the work, doesn't mean the SHOULD. I've gotten a lot more laid back with my homeschooling and my kids have actually thrived more like that. Their love of learning has increased. But that's just us. You might want to read up on Write With the Best on here b/c that's used in CTC. It's tough! And the readings are a bit much...quite heavy and long for a 2nd grader. Being open to dropping back to Bigger if needed is great. Remember that if you want them to do well with CTC, they'll need to be able to do all the PHFHG boxes with an I, totally on their own. Even being ahead and academically advanced, I really can't whole heartedly encourage you to do PHFHG with your little one. I really think you'd find BHFHG to be a great fit, and even if PHFHG goes okay for him this year, I think you'll run into a wall at CTC for a couple years or so. But, HOD is THE best thing we've ever used and I dno't want to drive you away from it. It's a real blessing. My gifted daughter that is 10 and in PHFHG can vouch that it's plenty and I am very pleased with the learning at this level and for her age. It's not lacking whatsoever though she will be ready to move to CTC before she completes it...she will be 11 and in 6th grade. PHFHG has been my favorite, but DD loved Bigger the most so far b/c of the book about John Audubon! She loved Bigger My just turned 8yo boy is still just enjoying being little this year and solidifying basics...he'll start Bigger next year for 3rd and is excited. HOD is just wonderful, so long as everyone is properly placed! You're very in tune to your kiddos skills so continue monitoring the younger one very closely and stay open to backing up a level or so.

Sorry this is just a bunch of random thoughts. I've had to do as I often do and post bits here and there between kid duty I'd check out the skill lists on the placement chart for both Bigger and master each and every one of those. And I'd start half pace for a few units at least to get your groove and really take the time to train them.

Sorry I couldn't be more coherent!

[mom2boys030507]

Mom2monkeys, I found your post to be very coherent. I agree with your statement of just because they can do the work, doesn't mean they should. But, for this child he wants to do the work. I really do appreciate your thoughts on our placement, they are giving me a lot to think about. I am also aware that we may hit a wall at CTC and I will deal with that if and/or when we hit it. I am just tired of trying to guess what will be good for a few years.

I do plan to start teaching my younger one cursive in the next few weeks. And I will continue working with both my boys on oral narration and copywork. They are being currently being trained to do what is written independently, but I am thinking I need to add to the length of directions they are following based on the samples.

Thank you for helping understand what they need to be doing skill wise at the beginning of Preparing. And, thank you for your concerns, they are not falling on deaf ears. You are asking the same questions my husband and I have been discussing for weeks.

[my3sons]

You have had such good dialogue hear already! I wonder if instead of trying to fill in with a lot of extra things to teach skills to start PHFHG, you could just do Bigger Hearts half-speed this summer? Maybe that is not what you are wanting at all, but it would be a way to teach excellent oral narration skills, teach the vocabulary lesson (you could just have them do 1 card, and that would still teach that skill nicely ), teach notebooking skills (and there are many to be learned ), teach how to do the Scientific Method on the lab sheet for experiments (which is done independently in PHFHG), teach timeline making skills, familiarize dc with Bible study involving character traits/memorization/music (in PHFHG 2 of the 4 Bible days are independent Bible Quiet Time with these elements), etc. BHFHG took us about 3 hours to do each day, so doing it half-speed in the summer would equal around 1 1/2 hours of time, which you may be at if you try to add in all of these skills. It also would be a great trial run to see if the 2 of them (or especially your youngest) would be best placed in BHFHG anyway. You could just order the first 9 weeks of it and see what happens. I would be inclined to agree with Tamara that PHFHG for a 7 yo would be pretty tough - I thought Bigger Hearts for a 7 yo was difficult enough. My 7 yo was reading 200+ page books (for fun), writing paragraphs with ease, and a pretty good oral narrator already when he began BHFHG, and it still was plenty a challenge. You will know best here, but that is just an idea to consider.

In Christ,
Julie

[blessedmomof4]

I posted before without noticing your boys' ages-I do agree w the pp, but you are mom, and it is up to you

[Mom2Monkeys]

Mom2monkeys, I found your post to be very coherent. I agree with your statement of just because they can do the work, doesn't mean they should. But, for this child he wants to do the work. I really do appreciate your thoughts on our placement, they are giving me a lot to think about. I am also aware that we may hit a wall at CTC and I will deal with that if and/or when we hit it. I am just tired of trying to guess what will be good for a few years.

I do plan to start teaching my younger one cursive in the next few weeks. And I will continue working with both my boys on oral narration and copywork. They are being currently being trained to do what is written independently, but I am thinking I need to add to the length of directions they are following based on the samples.

Thank you for helping understand what they need to be doing skill wise at the beginning of Preparing. And, thank you for your concerns, they are not falling on deaf ears. You are asking the same questions my husband and I have been discussing for weeks.

Have you considered doing Bigger and adding in extensions with the follow up assignments instead of jumping ahead a guide? It would be much more age appropriate and would give him that workload he desires.

Julie and I were posting at the same time!

[ninipelley]

Currently, he is in Singapore 2B, R&S 2, doing dictation with Spelling Wisdom, Hey Andrew Teach Me Some Greek Level 3, reading with comprehension at a 4th or 5th grade level, and starting to write narrations about once per week. He is an advanced student, keeping up or close to passing his older brother. I have learner to not consider his age or grade when looking at curriculum. I just have to look at skill level and then once we start adjust the expected output to what his maturity level can handle.

I hope you are taking this with a grain of salt. I needed alot of advice when first coming to HOD for placement as well. I was a bit frustrated with the posters advice as well to place in Beyond. I thought she was so much "smarter".
We started when my very quick bright learner was 7 and she was in Singapore 2a, 4th grade reading level, ready for cursive, advanced grammar. So I started her on Bigger and ended up actually going to Beyond by Christmas time. She just was not ready for the discipline of the Rod & Staff English (which I now love), or the amount of writing and the independence that Bigger is starting to work towards. So last fall at 8 she went on the Bigger (grade 3) and is doing so well. What a difference just the 1 year of age made. She just turned 9 last week and I know we will be ready for Preparing in the fall.

So, not to discourage you in any way, just telling you my experience. It's great to plan on moving back if necessary. You know your kiddo's best.
Good luck, let us know what you decide and how it goes.