My DS seems burned out by "school work" and he is only 5(almost 6). We were doing so well with workbooks and such and I could see there was a sort of hunger in him. Now he resists any sort of structure when it comes to school work. Structure meaning sit down work.
I know he is still learning. I've come up with ways to sort of "trick" him into learning math, practice spelling and handwriting. Usually it involves our chalkboard where we pretend we are a game show or something.
This fall I plan to formally start LHFHG and I'm concerned that he may resist Singapore math and the handwriting. It's easy to get the reading and hands on done.
I think in a previous post I shared how we felt like we were "unschooling". Anyone else with a child we does not like sit down work? And any suggestions you can share about how you make it work?
Thanks!
Burn out.......
-
netpea
My 5 yo (6 this week) can be like this at times. I usually just tell her she can sit and not do the work I ask of her, and she will remain seating all day missing out on the rest of the days actitivites until her work is done...OR...she can do her work now, be done in 1/2 hr or more, and then be ready for playing, etc.
Generally she moves right into doing her work.
Perhaps taking a day off and doing a fun day/field trip to give him a break, if that is what's needed...or arrange an outing for "x" amt of work done might be a good motivator.
Generally she moves right into doing her work.
Perhaps taking a day off and doing a fun day/field trip to give him a break, if that is what's needed...or arrange an outing for "x" amt of work done might be a good motivator.
mamamia,
Since you've been posting quite a bit about some concerns with your day lately, I went back and reread your original thread. Since you are obviously a very loving, caring mom with your son's best interests at heart, I'm going to take the time to address some of the things I noticed when re-reading your previous thread. I cannot get my quote feature to cooperate, so I'm going to intersperse your comments with mine. WARNING: This is long, so bear with me!
You said: "I visit this board daily! It's been a source of motivation on my many(lately)discouraging days. I keep saying "I can do it!"My DS will be turning 6 soon. I have both the LHFHG and BLHFHG in anticipation of the fall. This is what I am wondering...I have noticed that many of you have a schedule. Some seem to get all the work done in one sitting."
My reply: First of all, it seems like you are discouraged by the fact that you are not using a schedule. As I shared with you in a previous thread, we had a looser schedule when my first son was the only one schooling, however one of the down-sides of an unschooling approach is that kiddos who are not used to any kind of schedule will often balk at anything they perceive as "formal school".
You said: "We seem to be randomly working through things throughout the day. For example...this morning he got up and played while I vacuumed. Then during breakfast he did a couple of ETC workbook pages on his own(at his own choosing). He played a bit more then we did the continent song(in the appendix). Now he is on his computer."
My reply: When you use a random schedule, kiddos don't know what to expect. So, any time you are doing anything school-related, you will be pulling them away from their playtime. None of my boys ever like to be pulled away from their play either, as they will always choose to play or to do their own things rather than work. When you have a routine in place, kiddos know what to expect. They know when work time is, and they know when playtime is. That way work isn't intruding on play.
You said: "I have many books including all the supplements around the house. As the day goes on he may ask to read with me or look through the book. I may start talking about something in the history or science book etc. More play throughout the day(I have math manipulatives around etc)."
My reply: It sounds as if you are usually waiting on your little guy's cues to do your school-time, and even then you feel the need to cloak school as a care-free discussion to keep his interest. If children are used to being given the choice of whether to work or not, they can't understand later when they suddenly aren't able to choose, and it feels as if someone is forcing "school" or "work" on them.
You said: "Then at bedtime we will read and talk about a Bible story, read from the science or whatever other book."
My reply: Most young ones do their best schooling in the mid-morning, before lunch, when they are at their best. Bedtimes are good for reading aloud, but usually for pleasure. Reading their science or scheduled school-books at bedtime is setting those books up for failure because they require concentration (which is really lacking as kiddos and mom wind down for the evening). As kiddos are winding down, it isn't the easiest time to try to insert formal schooling.
You said: "Last night while reading he started talking about noun,verbs, adverbs etc. We made a poster that we list our scripture we are learning. I also made a creation poster. I'll do random things like that to grab his interest. Is it ok to be so unstructured? Am I doing enough?"
My reply: My concern with randomely doing things to grab your child's attention is that the skills that are truly needed for life-long learning are often not covered this way. It is saying that the child is the leader and is able to be the "course-setter" for their education, which is a heavy load for a 6 year old.
You said: "I'm starting to think that I lean toward unschooling. It seems we do the work but not always in the order of the manual."
My reply: "You do very well sound like right now you are leaning toward unschooling in your approach. If that is truly where your heart is, then I will tell you in all love and respect that Heart of Dakota may not be the best fit for you. Our guides do fall easily into many different teaching approaches, but unschooling with HOD would be a stretch.
If, however, you are just trying to find your way, and actually would be more comfortable with some sort of schedule, then you can definitely make the Heart of Dakota guide work for you.
The guides certainly do not need to have the "boxes" of each day done in a certain order or at a certain time. They do, however, require formal teaching. This is not written as a delight-directed or a child-directed study. Our guides do require some scheduled focused, teacher/student time.
Many loosely scheduled moms use our guides, and many very scheduled moms use our guides. But without any schedule, you will struggle with HOD.
Our guides are designed to be short and to the point, so your child has time left-over to pursue their God-given interests. The lessons and activities in HOD are meant to spark your child's passions and interests.
For example, due to the activities in "Bigger..." this year, my middle son has used his free time in the afternoons and evenings to become an avid sketcher of birds and nature, has experimented endlessly with paper planes and lift, is currently writing poetry about everything (using meter, rhyme, and other poetry devices all on his own), made flip-books about George Washington and the Revolutionary War, recorded one of our read-aloud books on tape complete with sound effects and voices, and made puppet shows about different biographical characters we've read about in "Bigger...". All of these ideas were his own and were delight-directed or child-directed.
I do believe that our guides inspire that kind of learning, yet I still believe their needs to be formal teaching. Your belief system may be very different, and that's o.k.
It really comes down to your teaching style and philosophy in finding the best fit for you and your family. I would never have responded so thoroughly, except I genuinely wish to help you sort through your beliefs and find what will work for you.
Blessings,
Carrie
Since you've been posting quite a bit about some concerns with your day lately, I went back and reread your original thread. Since you are obviously a very loving, caring mom with your son's best interests at heart, I'm going to take the time to address some of the things I noticed when re-reading your previous thread. I cannot get my quote feature to cooperate, so I'm going to intersperse your comments with mine. WARNING: This is long, so bear with me!
You said: "I visit this board daily! It's been a source of motivation on my many(lately)discouraging days. I keep saying "I can do it!"My DS will be turning 6 soon. I have both the LHFHG and BLHFHG in anticipation of the fall. This is what I am wondering...I have noticed that many of you have a schedule. Some seem to get all the work done in one sitting."
My reply: First of all, it seems like you are discouraged by the fact that you are not using a schedule. As I shared with you in a previous thread, we had a looser schedule when my first son was the only one schooling, however one of the down-sides of an unschooling approach is that kiddos who are not used to any kind of schedule will often balk at anything they perceive as "formal school".
You said: "We seem to be randomly working through things throughout the day. For example...this morning he got up and played while I vacuumed. Then during breakfast he did a couple of ETC workbook pages on his own(at his own choosing). He played a bit more then we did the continent song(in the appendix). Now he is on his computer."
My reply: When you use a random schedule, kiddos don't know what to expect. So, any time you are doing anything school-related, you will be pulling them away from their playtime. None of my boys ever like to be pulled away from their play either, as they will always choose to play or to do their own things rather than work. When you have a routine in place, kiddos know what to expect. They know when work time is, and they know when playtime is. That way work isn't intruding on play.
You said: "I have many books including all the supplements around the house. As the day goes on he may ask to read with me or look through the book. I may start talking about something in the history or science book etc. More play throughout the day(I have math manipulatives around etc)."
My reply: It sounds as if you are usually waiting on your little guy's cues to do your school-time, and even then you feel the need to cloak school as a care-free discussion to keep his interest. If children are used to being given the choice of whether to work or not, they can't understand later when they suddenly aren't able to choose, and it feels as if someone is forcing "school" or "work" on them.
You said: "Then at bedtime we will read and talk about a Bible story, read from the science or whatever other book."
My reply: Most young ones do their best schooling in the mid-morning, before lunch, when they are at their best. Bedtimes are good for reading aloud, but usually for pleasure. Reading their science or scheduled school-books at bedtime is setting those books up for failure because they require concentration (which is really lacking as kiddos and mom wind down for the evening). As kiddos are winding down, it isn't the easiest time to try to insert formal schooling.
You said: "Last night while reading he started talking about noun,verbs, adverbs etc. We made a poster that we list our scripture we are learning. I also made a creation poster. I'll do random things like that to grab his interest. Is it ok to be so unstructured? Am I doing enough?"
My reply: My concern with randomely doing things to grab your child's attention is that the skills that are truly needed for life-long learning are often not covered this way. It is saying that the child is the leader and is able to be the "course-setter" for their education, which is a heavy load for a 6 year old.
You said: "I'm starting to think that I lean toward unschooling. It seems we do the work but not always in the order of the manual."
My reply: "You do very well sound like right now you are leaning toward unschooling in your approach. If that is truly where your heart is, then I will tell you in all love and respect that Heart of Dakota may not be the best fit for you. Our guides do fall easily into many different teaching approaches, but unschooling with HOD would be a stretch.
If, however, you are just trying to find your way, and actually would be more comfortable with some sort of schedule, then you can definitely make the Heart of Dakota guide work for you.
The guides certainly do not need to have the "boxes" of each day done in a certain order or at a certain time. They do, however, require formal teaching. This is not written as a delight-directed or a child-directed study. Our guides do require some scheduled focused, teacher/student time.
Many loosely scheduled moms use our guides, and many very scheduled moms use our guides. But without any schedule, you will struggle with HOD.
Our guides are designed to be short and to the point, so your child has time left-over to pursue their God-given interests. The lessons and activities in HOD are meant to spark your child's passions and interests.
For example, due to the activities in "Bigger..." this year, my middle son has used his free time in the afternoons and evenings to become an avid sketcher of birds and nature, has experimented endlessly with paper planes and lift, is currently writing poetry about everything (using meter, rhyme, and other poetry devices all on his own), made flip-books about George Washington and the Revolutionary War, recorded one of our read-aloud books on tape complete with sound effects and voices, and made puppet shows about different biographical characters we've read about in "Bigger...". All of these ideas were his own and were delight-directed or child-directed.
I do believe that our guides inspire that kind of learning, yet I still believe their needs to be formal teaching. Your belief system may be very different, and that's o.k.
It really comes down to your teaching style and philosophy in finding the best fit for you and your family. I would never have responded so thoroughly, except I genuinely wish to help you sort through your beliefs and find what will work for you.
Blessings,
Carrie
Last edited by Carrie on Mon Apr 28, 2008 5:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Carrie,
Thanks for taking the time to write all that! I appreciate you sharing your thoughts. First, reading over my quotes I thought "yikes" I sound sort of flakey! Communicating my thoughts effectively is not a gift of mine I think because I am a new homeschooler I'm still learning what will work and just the right way to implement it. With the Lords help I know I will get it. I guess I am one of those people who do better when encouraged that I am doing the right thing(my DH is the opposite-we balance eachother).
It's funny, my intention is not to be an un-schooler. I also do not want to replicate what my DS would have had in school. We do have a routine I guess it's just not a school in the morning routine. Usually the afternoon works better for us. Also we get much done after dinner. I remind myself that he is just in Kindergarten. But I'm going to really take note of our day and see if he IS leading it......I know that is not a healthy thing for either of us.
hmmmm, much to think about. I'll be honest....your post made me a little sad because I really want HOD to work for us. I blame myself for not teaching it well or structuring our day well. Can I borrow one of you awesome homeschool moms to teach me how? Come live with us for a week !
Thanks again for your insight
Thanks for taking the time to write all that! I appreciate you sharing your thoughts. First, reading over my quotes I thought "yikes" I sound sort of flakey! Communicating my thoughts effectively is not a gift of mine
I think because I am a new homeschooler I'm still learning what will work and just the right way to implement it. With the Lords help I know I will get it. I guess I am one of those people who do better when encouraged that I am doing the right thing(my DH is the opposite-we balance eachother). It's funny, my intention is not to be an un-schooler. I also do not want to replicate what my DS would have had in school. We do have a routine I guess it's just not a school in the morning routine. Usually the afternoon works better for us. Also we get much done after dinner. I remind myself that he is just in Kindergarten. But I'm going to really take note of our day and see if he IS leading it......I know that is not a healthy thing for either of us.
hmmmm, much to think about. I'll be honest....your post made me a little sad because I really want HOD to work for us. I blame myself for not teaching it well or structuring our day well. Can I borrow one of you awesome homeschool moms to teach me how? Come live with us for a week
! Thanks again for your insight
Carrie,
Thanks for your post. It helped me to see some of the holes in our household too. I, like the OP, have not really set a good schedule example for my DD yet. And you're right, if left to chose, they will not chose school over play.
So OP'er, I feel your growing pains too. Now I must set in my mind that each day I will be more purposeful in doing what needs to be done instead of flounder through our day.
Thanks for your post. It helped me to see some of the holes in our household too. I, like the OP, have not really set a good schedule example for my DD yet. And you're right, if left to chose, they will not chose school over play.
So OP'er, I feel your growing pains too. Now I must set in my mind that each day I will be more purposeful in doing what needs to be done instead of flounder through our day.
Crystal
DD 20 married college graduate
DS 17 college student
DD 11 CTC
Finished: LHTH, LHFHG, BLHFHG, BHFHG, PHFHG, CTC, Res to Ref, Rev to Rev, MTMM, parts of WG and WH
DD 20 married college graduate
DS 17 college student
DD 11 CTC
Finished: LHTH, LHFHG, BLHFHG, BHFHG, PHFHG, CTC, Res to Ref, Rev to Rev, MTMM, parts of WG and WH
-
amysconfections
- Posts: 247
- Joined: Sun Sep 30, 2007 1:37 pm
- Location: AL
Carrie, as usual, had great advice for you. We have worked into a formal schedule that's more strict now that we are almost done with my son's year of K. What has helped us the most is to have a school room. In the morning we do our regular chores and try to clean up a little before school time. Then we go to our schoolroom and do all our school. There are exceptions when we have a busy day, etc. But we do strive to do all our school in the morning in one sitting. The main exception I have is handwriting. I am having him do extra that he does at the kitchen counter while I cook supper. He is usually ready to sit then. I have found that the sitting time for seat work in LHFHG is so small that it's not a chore for him to sit through. But, he does find it easier to sit still in the morning time. I hope this encourages you and helps you.
Amy
T-18 Masters degree Cyber Security WGU
T-16 Bachelors in Cyber Security WGU
A-12 Res to Ref
A-10 Res to Ref
Heart of Dakota user since 2007.
T-18 Masters degree Cyber Security WGU
T-16 Bachelors in Cyber Security WGU
A-12 Res to Ref
A-10 Res to Ref
Heart of Dakota user since 2007.
Oh Ladies,
I certainly didn't mean to be discouraging! In your previous threads, mamamia, I know all of the moms and I really chimed in to encourage and uplift you and give a few helpful hints and suggestions that might be of help to you. Then, with your newest post here, I could just feel your on-going frustration!
This is the problem-solver in me coming out without the much-needed empathy as well.
It's not that I think you can't do it or that you're doing it all wrong, it's just a matter of wanting to help you sort out where the stumbling blocks might be in your day.
I've had many "AHA" moments in my teaching career, where I realized that things I had been holding onto or patterns I had fallen into teaching-wise weren't working for me or my kiddos. I still have these moments after almost 20 years of teaching, and I feel that they are key to re-directing me or my children (so I can continue on with our calling to homeschool our kiddos). Without these moments, I fear I would burn out myself or my children. So, with the title of your thread I sensed a moment like that in you!
My only desire is to help you on your journey to homeschool your kiddos. It's why I spend so much time on this board personally responding to each and every one of you. There is a time to encourage and also a time for concrete advice (which I definitely need to work on delivering with more empathy!) I know you can use Heart of Dakota successfully, and with just a few minor changes you'll be feeling better about your homeschool day.
No two moms use Heart of Dakota in the same way. There is not one "right way" to do it. I'd encourage you to ponder some of the advice I gave you and see what you think. Try some of the things I mentioned and find what works for you. But, I know from talking to many, many, many homeschool moms that when things feel like they aren't working and words like "burnout" come up for you or your kiddos, change of some sort is needed.
Blessings,
Carrie
I certainly didn't mean to be discouraging! In your previous threads, mamamia, I know all of the moms and I really chimed in to encourage and uplift you and give a few helpful hints and suggestions that might be of help to you. Then, with your newest post here, I could just feel your on-going frustration!
This is the problem-solver in me coming out without the much-needed empathy as well.
It's not that I think you can't do it or that you're doing it all wrong, it's just a matter of wanting to help you sort out where the stumbling blocks might be in your day. I've had many "AHA" moments in my teaching career, where I realized that things I had been holding onto or patterns I had fallen into teaching-wise weren't working for me or my kiddos. I still have these moments after almost 20 years of teaching, and I feel that they are key to re-directing me or my children (so I can continue on with our calling to homeschool our kiddos). Without these moments, I fear I would burn out myself or my children. So, with the title of your thread I sensed a moment like that in you!
My only desire is to help you on your journey to homeschool your kiddos. It's why I spend so much time on this board personally responding to each and every one of you. There is a time to encourage and also a time for concrete advice (which I definitely need to work on delivering with more empathy!)
I know you can use Heart of Dakota successfully, and with just a few minor changes you'll be feeling better about your homeschool day. No two moms use Heart of Dakota in the same way. There is not one "right way" to do it. I'd encourage you to ponder some of the advice I gave you and see what you think. Try some of the things I mentioned and find what works for you. But, I know from talking to many, many, many homeschool moms that when things feel like they aren't working and words like "burnout" come up for you or your kiddos, change of some sort is needed.
Blessings,
Carrie
-
inHistiming
- Posts: 1301
- Joined: Tue Aug 28, 2007 2:30 pm
- Location: Central VA
- Contact:
One good thing is this: if you want to implement a schedule, with Carrie's short lessons, ds will only have to sit still to listen and do his 'work' for 1.5 hours (I think). Then, when he's gotten used to that, and it's time to move into the next guide and spend more time, he'll know it is required. I think you can introduce this slowly, and be successful. There will be days it will be frustrating, I think it is for all of us. But, after the initial adjustment period, I think he (and you) will like it. If nothing else you can try it; then move on to something else if you decide HOD doesn't fit your learning style, KWIM? If you have any more questions, please ask!
dd 6 & dd (almost) 5 starting LHFHG
http://www.wendywoerner.com
http://www.wendywoerner.arbonne.com
http://www.jaminmom.com
http://www.wendywoerner.com
http://www.wendywoerner.arbonne.com
http://www.jaminmom.com
I can pipe in here, to encourage, too, I hope!
When I was only schooling my oldest child, we had a much more flexible schedule. This was good, because that year I was pregnant, had a 5y.o., a 3y.o. and an active 1y.o. Flexibility was great. BUT it had a price and Carrie articulated it excellently. My son never knew when school was coming. Inevitably I would get to a part of our day where I sort of stressed that we hadn't done XY or Z and I would spring it on him. He would balk, I would scold and we'd both stress through it. It was actually worse for us. I continued this randomly scheduled day for first grade also, as I was working around the baby's schedule. My son started to ask me for a list of his day!!! I am not kidding. He asked me to write down his day so he knew what was coming!
God has really stretched me back and forth and back and forth on this.
I am a highly scheduled person by nature.
Then I had children and learned that you can't schedule diaper blow-outs and emergency baths and trips to the doctor, so I got flexible and really enjoyed those toddler/preschooler years of go with the flow.
Then we started homeschooling and I am back to needing a schedule... while trying to preserve go-with-the-flow-toddlerness in my younger kids!
This year I developed a schedule and we work really hard to keep it. I haven't quite gotten to Managers of their Homes level, but I am working toward it.
I will say having a schedule not only keeps the kids accountable, but it keeps me accountable as well. I have to confess that I know now, in retrospect, that it was that accountability I was afraid of.
I don't know what the whole family make up is for you, and your long-term goals, besides your desire to use this awesome program. I can say that my own kids do so much better when they know what is expected.
I will say that my two boys both do well with afternoon school! I have used the girls' naptime/quiet time all these years to do that. We DO do school in the morning, but we have always saved a chunk for the afternoon. I have just started doing it all in the morning two weeks ago, and that is b/c we had all that awesome weather and we wanted to do yard work in the afternoon. [Today not so much!]
We can get school done, for both boys, in about 2.5 hours. That includes bathroom breaks, potty training the little one, and helping my 3 year old in and out of dress up clothes.
When I was only schooling my oldest child, we had a much more flexible schedule. This was good, because that year I was pregnant, had a 5y.o., a 3y.o. and an active 1y.o. Flexibility was great. BUT it had a price and Carrie articulated it excellently. My son never knew when school was coming. Inevitably I would get to a part of our day where I sort of stressed that we hadn't done XY or Z and I would spring it on him. He would balk, I would scold and we'd both stress through it. It was actually worse for us. I continued this randomly scheduled day for first grade also, as I was working around the baby's schedule. My son started to ask me for a list of his day!!! I am not kidding. He asked me to write down his day so he knew what was coming!
God has really stretched me back and forth and back and forth on this.
I am a highly scheduled person by nature.
Then I had children and learned that you can't schedule diaper blow-outs and emergency baths and trips to the doctor, so I got flexible and really enjoyed those toddler/preschooler years of go with the flow.
Then we started homeschooling and I am back to needing a schedule... while trying to preserve go-with-the-flow-toddlerness in my younger kids!
This year I developed a schedule and we work really hard to keep it. I haven't quite gotten to Managers of their Homes level, but I am working toward it.
I will say having a schedule not only keeps the kids accountable, but it keeps me accountable as well. I have to confess that I know now, in retrospect, that it was that accountability I was afraid of. I don't know what the whole family make up is for you, and your long-term goals, besides your desire to use this awesome program. I can say that my own kids do so much better when they know what is expected.
I will say that my two boys both do well with afternoon school! I have used the girls' naptime/quiet time all these years to do that. We DO do school in the morning, but we have always saved a chunk for the afternoon. I have just started doing it all in the morning two weeks ago, and that is b/c we had all that awesome weather and we wanted to do yard work in the afternoon. [Today not so much!]
We can get school done, for both boys, in about 2.5 hours. That includes bathroom breaks, potty training the little one, and helping my 3 year old in and out of dress up clothes.
Fall 2015
DS 17 -gr.12 full time college student
DS 15- gr. 10 favorites from World Geo and World Hx.
DD 13- gr. 8 Rev to Rev
DD 11- gr. 6 CTC
DD 7 - gr. 2 Beyond
DD 4 - pre-K Rod & Staff and Phonics Pathways
I thought of something last night.
Could you just make a list of what you want to accomplish each day, but still allow him to decide when to do each thing?
Could you just make a list of what you want to accomplish each day, but still allow him to decide when to do each thing?
Fall 2015
DS 17 -gr.12 full time college student
DS 15- gr. 10 favorites from World Geo and World Hx.
DD 13- gr. 8 Rev to Rev
DD 11- gr. 6 CTC
DD 7 - gr. 2 Beyond
DD 4 - pre-K Rod & Staff and Phonics Pathways
you most certainly have not. Rather you sound like most homeschool moms I know. We are all finding our way. We are on the path God set us on, but none of our paths look the same.
I think most of us just want to share that homeschooling patterns aren't black and white.
I have found when I get lots of suggestions from people, usually only a few tidbits will fit for my life. But sometimes it only takes one tidbit to really bless my family. The rest of the tidbits can be set aside. ♥♥
I think most of us just want to share that homeschooling patterns aren't black and white.
I have found when I get lots of suggestions from people, usually only a few tidbits will fit for my life. But sometimes it only takes one tidbit to really bless my family. The rest of the tidbits can be set aside. ♥♥
Fall 2015
DS 17 -gr.12 full time college student
DS 15- gr. 10 favorites from World Geo and World Hx.
DD 13- gr. 8 Rev to Rev
DD 11- gr. 6 CTC
DD 7 - gr. 2 Beyond
DD 4 - pre-K Rod & Staff and Phonics Pathways