Getting ready for Beyond

[SarahAngeline]

I've heard a lot of talk regarding the value of having your child placed in the upper age ranges of the guides. I'm wondering if anyone could chime in on my situation. My 6 yr old (Oct birthday) has about 10 weeks left of LHFHG. His FMS were very poor beginning this year but he has progressed beautifully and is now writing his letters and numbers. He is doing well in phonics, we are using TRL and really taking our time. We are only half way through TRL as we have repeated a lot of lessons. He's hit a stride now and I think the 2nd half will go faster. We plan to continue phonics over the summer.

My question is regarding his reading comprehension. In general he is a kinesthetic learner. The history does not stick until we complete the rotating box. Then he gets it. But on general when I am reading to him I feel like he zones out. History Stories for Children seems over his head, Devotions for the Children's Hour feels the same to me. We are reading the Burgess books but again, he doesn't get too into them and usually has difficulty with the comprehension questions. We still do them and I give him clues to figure it out.

I guess I'm just wondering if this is normal as regards the reading comprehension. Being that he's a hands on learner, I wonder if this would be the case no matter what we were reading. I'm wondering if the history and such in Beyond would be too over his head, and if there would be some value in having him do that guide for 2nd instead of first? I've heard that the readings being over grade level is intentional to expose them to complex language... If that's the case then that is fine. Otherwise I wonder if he's get more out of the readings of he were a little older.

Would love to hear your thoughts on this. Thanks so much.

[SarahAngeline]

Although I should add that he normally loves to be read children's books and he loves the library. He will let me read those books to him for hours. Of course they have pictures and feel more age appropriate.

[StephanieU]

Some kids need something in their hands. I remember when I was in middle school. I would doodle and draw during history to help me focus. If I just sat there and tried to listen, I would start day dreaming. So, I would look for something for him to do while listening. That could be coloring pages, play dough, squishy ball, etc. But I also think it is somewhat age appropriate. Beyond still has an activity for the history, so that isn't going away. But, the reading (both history and storytime) is longer. So, having something for him to do while listening will help. Oh, and some families do storytime over lunch. It works because they are busy but not distracted because they are eating.

[SarahAngeline]

Honestly I read the history during breakfast or I allow him to have something on his hands. He looks forward to story time because we serve snack during story time. I guess I'm just wondering what is age appropriate as far as how much to expect him to retain. I'm also wondering what the goal of the readings is. I know the books for LHFHG are above grade level. If the goal is to expose children to more complex language and stretch them to retain more, then that is one thing. If it's ok that h can't answer all of the retention questions then that is ok. But if the goal is for him to be able to retain and articulate and retain the history, etc then I wonder if we are placed properly. He is being challenged every day and I see THAT as a definite positive!

[SarahAngeline]

Please excuse the many typos, I'm on my iPhone.

[MelInKansas]

I had similar problems with my DD in LHFHG. She is a very kinesthetic learner though as she has learned to read and can read along with me while I do read-alouds she has gotten better at retaining things. She was terrible at the narration/storytime answers for the longest time but the last 2 years she has shown dramatic improvement and now she can give a wonderful narration after listening to me read something.

What I have heard Carrie or Julie talk about is that the history is above grade level and the activities to go along are to help them retain and understand it (which they work wonderfully, don't they?) The questions in the history books are too difficult for LHFHG kids and so if they cannot answer them that is not a big deal. The activities with the Storytime stories are supposed to be on their level though and they should grow in that throughout the year. Giving him something to do with his hands might help, though I don't know if eating is the right thing or not. I find it harder to listen when I am eating.

It got much better in Beyond for us. Of course she was older and more mature, but also I think the read-alouds in Beyond are a lot more interesting and she really enjoyed them. Storytime was more fun too. She really liked the Burgess books and other Storytime titles in LHFHG though, even if she couldn't answer the questions really well, the cliffhanger at the end of each chapter really caught her attention.

If you continue to see that he just really is NOT getting it he may just need some time to grow. He is at the young end of the age ranges anyway, so he has time. Maybe you could slow down to 1/2 speed to give him that time. You could keep going every day with math, handwriting, and reading/phonics if you want to keep those things sharp and he is progressing well in those, and then split up the History, storytime, poetry, rotating box, Bible doing 1/2 each day. Or do totally 1/2 speed where you do one side of the plans each day and the other side the next. (I am describing Beyond, you could even go 1/2 speed for the rest of LHFHG if you wish).

[MomtoJGJE]

Is he going to be 6 or 7 in October? I couldn't really tell from your post.

None of my kids so far have liked the Burgess books... as a result they can't answer anything about it. Has he progressed in that any throughout the year? If so then he's fine I think.

About the history... he doesn't have the building blocks yet to retain the information. You are GIVING him the blocks that he builds on later. As I get farther along in HOD I'm finding this more and more true. If he can sit through the readings then he is fine. There's a lot of time between now and the fall to mature.

So with that said I'd move on and finish up LHFHG full speed. Then when you start Beyond I'd split it up half speed. I like to do history and Bible reading one day and then the rotating box and Bible activity on the next day just to split it up better and give them time to absorb and make connections on the readings. So my half speed looks more like History, Bible, poetry, math on day one and rotating box, Bible activity, Story time, LA, reading on day two. We listen to the music in the van whenever and then discuss the song when appropriate with the Bible lesson.

You'll be able to tell when he needs more per day.

[SarahAngeline]

He'll be 7 in October

[my3sons]

My ds could not answer the history questions at the end of the chapters in the history books very well at all in LHFHG, and his narrating improved from beginning to end, but is (and continues to be) a work in progress. This thread should help, especially Carrie's response at the bottom in regard to her intentions with the LHFHG plans...
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=14933&p=105572

For my bodily kinesthetic learner, I sit on the couch next to him and put my arm around him as I read. He absolutely needs to see the book and pictures to focus. He still twitches and shakes, but he listens and follows along better! Letting him do other things or sitting at a table and me reading far away just gets him off and focusing on whatever he is BK doing, like rocking his chair back and forth or tapping his pencil, etc. Carrie suggested cuddling up on the couch such as this with wiggly ones, and it has really helped. As they get older, following along with the read aloud is helpful to retaining information and remaining focused as well, so seeing the words as they are read aloud and following along really helps then too. You can read Carrie's advice here...
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=11565&p=84226

Your ds sounds quiet typical to me, and moving on to Beyond Little Hearts for His Glory should be just fine. Remember you can always take it more slowly if needed - HOD is very flexible like that. You could easily take 3 years to do Beyond and Bigger Hearts, spending about 1 1/2 years on each, should you feel that would be a better pacing for ds. However, I'd start full-speed Beyond and see how it goes first. No matter what the pacing is, moving forward with Heart of Dakota's line of guides amounts to more forward progress than taking a break and doing something different, as that something different really won't build and grow all of those important skills and habits as effectively as the beautifully, intentionally, incrementally planned skills from guide to guide across the years like HOD. HTH!

In Christ,
Julie

[SarahAngeline]

I appreciate the advice and I have a few more questions.

Julie, i read the threads you posted. So how do I really know if it would be a good idea to slow down the guides? My son is doing well with phonics, math and fine motor skills. It's the history that I worry about being over his head comprehension wise. I worry that if we keep going full speed that he won't retain the history.

I know that stretching out beyond and bigger is an option, but in that case how do you keep your child on grade level with math and language arts? If you stretch out the guides to take an extra year before starting PHFHG?

How about completing Beyond in 2 yrs completing right side full speed for 1st and 2nd grade, with left side going half speed?

Or is this all something I shouldn't be too concerned about? With the literature being such a big part of the program, I just feel like he should be comprehending and retaining better than he is. Also I was wondering, what is the reasoning for the readings being above grade level? I feel like knowing the reasoning behind that would help me make my choice.

[MelInKansas]

We just kept on going full speed (for right or wrong) because my DD seemed able to handle it, even though she didn't really seem to retain much of the reading. I saw her improve dramatically probably in Bigger. Again, this may have gone along with when she could read well enough to read along with me when I was reading to her. I mean, narration and response questions were NOTHING in LHFHG and Beyond. Blank stares. I would give her a word or two or a reminder and then she could come up with something. The guidance written in Beyond for helping them work on narration is really great and I wish I had used it more with her than I did. By this I mean the storytime box and the things you do there to help the child narrate.

She still sometimes listens and narrates to me twisted up in a pretzel shape. It kind of drives me crazy but sometimes I feel like I should just go with it. The beauty of homeschooling right, they don't have to sit all rigid in a desk in order to learn.

She has always enjoyed listening to the readings, again since I felt like she was doing okay with it except for the comprehension we just plugged away. Now we did have to slow down in Bigger because the writing work was too much for her and Bigger took us 1 1/2 years. I think when you need to slow down you will know. There will be struggle from the child and frustration. Having been through them up to Preparing, I think LHFHG and Beyond are really for walking them through narration and lots of hand-holding. So it's okay if he can't do much right now, he is being exposed and he will learn it.

[TrueGRIT]

I agree with MelInKansas that you keep going full-speed until they are struggling with a concept or to get a full days work done. Then you move to half-speed. I also read to my children besides school and will sometimes ask them to tell me their favorite part - and that seems to help some with comprehension. The very earliest guides are still going to need a lot of attention. I would probably only move to 1/2 speed based on that alone if he couldn't do it after the initial "start-up" weeks of Bigger.

[SarahAngeline]

Thanks for all the great advice ladies